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Baby Flite Streak build thread

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Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  RknRusty on Sat Apr 28, 2012 10:26 am

I cleaned off my table and laid down a fresh building surface, read the instruction booklet about 5 times. The first three times I kept skipping to the end to see how it comes out. This plane is BIG for a baby. It looks like a challenge for a TD .051,so I need to keep it light but strong. Therein lies my first question.

Starting with the Jumpin Bean last Spring, I was new to modeling with CA . I primarily used Medium thickness rubberized Gorilla brand CA. At the time I didn't know about assembling first, then gluing as the CA wicks into the balsa. But the medium CA was forgiving enough that I could align parts as it dried. My question is, for the wicking method, will the medium CA work, or is thin the only way to go? I read a lot of posts claiming the thin CA was too brittle. I don't happen to think it's a problem. I have both and was just curious as to our forum modelers' thoughts on this.
Thanks,
Rusty


Last edited by RknRusty on Tue Jul 09, 2013 10:36 pm; edited 7 times in total

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  crankbndr on Sat Apr 28, 2012 10:47 am

I like the thin CA, the set is instant and very strong.
Used it on this Baby Flite Streak. I found the leading edge design to be a pain.


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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  nitroairplane on Sat Apr 28, 2012 10:52 am

I like medium CA, i find the thin stuff gets very messy.

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  daviddiag on Sat Apr 28, 2012 11:58 am

I use the thin ca with good results. I never liked the thicker stuff as it seemed like an attempt to make ca like other slow set glues. It has its uses but the thin is quick and solid. I have planes that I built in the late 70s and early 80s that were recently found in storage, and are as sturdy as they ever were. Hope to be flying them again soon.

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  RknRusty on Sat Apr 28, 2012 2:50 pm

Thin it is, thanks.
I'll probably use epoxy on the nose for the engine and fuel tank mounting parts. Airplane glue for the hinges. I'm getting started now.

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  Cribbs74 on Sat Apr 28, 2012 4:28 pm

I'm with Indra, the thin stuff get's everywhere. Make sure your lighting is good as sometimes it doesn't look like it coming out until it drips on your pants and glues your fingers to the plane.

Medium does wick just not as quickly. As far as setting times you can use kicker although I have heard it makes the joint brittle.

I guess your best bet is trial and error. I would use epoxy for the engine area and anything under stress like you said.


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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  Ivanhoe on Sat Apr 28, 2012 7:18 pm

I use all 3 grades, thin, medium and thick. The real advantage for me with med and thick is not so much the slower drying times but the fact that they will gap-fill, I have been known to get fits not quite right (believe it or not!) and that is when I reach for the med to thick stuff!
One tip, learned many years ago. When "Super" glues (CA) first came on to the market the papers were full of horror stories about Little Jimmy gluing his fingers, or other body parts together, and parents were terrified that their little darling would get glued up if they allowed him to use it. I was running the model shop at the time, and my party trick was to deliberately glue my fingers together, then demonstrate the safe method of separating them (CA solvents didn't exist then) If you do ever stick yourself (and we all do!) and you don't have the solvent handy, use a blunt kitchen knife to slowly separate the glued digits a little at a time. This method was actually printed on the tubes at that time.

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  Ivanhoe on Sat Apr 28, 2012 7:23 pm

crankbndr wrote:Used it on this Baby Flite Streak. I found the leading edge design to be a pain.

I've never built a Flite Streak, but if the L/E is the same as on the Peacemaker (The original design that the FS was developed from) I heartily agree!

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  andrew on Sat Apr 28, 2012 8:27 pm

Of the CA's, I use only thin. Just be sure your joints are tight since it does not bridge.

For laminating, balsa to balsa, balsa to foam and some gluing of foam, I use polyurethane.

For fuel proofing and high stress joints, I like 30 min. epoxy.

I believe the difficulty with thin CA is determining where it goes and how much gets laid down. The standard bottle spout alone does not work well for me, but used with thin teflon tubing, I can extend the reach and apply a single very small drop where I want. Because of the tiny ID, I can also run the tubing along a joint and the capillary action gives me a good continuous application.

I keep several spouts on hand with only a small hole in the end -- push an inch or so of tubing in and you have a nice applicator. When finished, everything goes into a jar of acetone -- all the crusted CA is dissolved when I'm ready to use again. I keep the bottle capped with a spout that hasn't been clipped.

Source for teflon tubing: http://www.mcmaster.com/#spaghetti-tubing/=hb2vqx

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  RknRusty on Sat Apr 28, 2012 9:33 pm

Thanks for the replies. Like Ivanhoe said about gap filling with thicker CA, I too have used it for that, sometimes with a dusting of baking soda to make a tight bond in a gap. I'm mostly gluing with the thin Loctite brand, and also have medium Gorilla brand CA. I don't use kicker. And I've been a loyal epoxy user for ever. I even use it if engine mounting screws won't tighten enough. To remove them, I just heat the screw head with a soldering iron and if frees up instantly.

I got tired of working on the wing today so I went out to fly. I wanted to fly the Li'l Satan/RR1 but it was too windy, so I flew the Stuntman. I pumped 45cc into the bladder and thought it was never going to run out. When I finally landed, my wife and the pizza delivery guy were watching me. I gotta go out and clean it up, so I'll probably work on the Streak some more.

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Re: Baby Flight Streak build thread, Q&A

Post  proctor on Sat Apr 28, 2012 9:56 pm

Great stuff Andrew on CA, can't find a source in UK though for teflon
tubing.
I use thin CA to tack balsa joints and then follow up with Super Phatic
made by Deluxe Materials here in UK. It is a watery penetrating aliphatic
glue. Secret for using it is to go over all your joints with a small paint brush
dipped in water, then apply glue and it wicks in just like CA but gives a
strong flexible joint. Incidentally Hobby King sells Bob Smith Industries
thin Ca, the best CA I've found.
I use thin laminating epoxy for laminating ply doublers to balsa and
30min for engine bearers, firewalls etc.
Looking for thin plastic tube to replace Dubro 20" micro pushrod systems
which are very pricey here in UK. John

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  RknRusty on Sun Apr 29, 2012 1:51 am

Y'all are right about the lead edge being a pain in the ass. The jigs didn't give it the same shape as the ends of the ribs. It's all perfectly straight, but there will be gaps that need filling. I don't want to get too heavy, but it really looks like a job for epoxy and sawdust. I'll wait until the rest of the wing is glued up before I finish that. For now I just need to make sure I get the lead edge pointing straight forward.


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Sunday's update

Post  RknRusty on Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:09 am

Somehow I misunderstood the illustration in the book about fitting the LE pieces together, so I botched it. It's okay, I always botch at least one part and I always work it out. Hopefully this will be the only mistake. Anyhoo, it's glued too tight to undo and it's misshapen. So I spent a couple of hours with a razor plane and a sanding block re-shaping the airfoil so it points straight ahead. It looks good, maybe slightly sharper than the plans intended but I think it will fly fine. However after removing wood to get the shape right, it's now pretty thin. And there are gaps where the parts don't meet up quite right, as you can see in the picture.


I should have just made another one from my wood supply, but I thought it was going to fit better until after it was all glued. This leaves me with a couple of options, which I have yet to decide on. I could mix up some 60 minute epoxy with sawdust and run a bead of it down the inside for strength and gap filler. That would be very strong, but might weigh more than I want it to. This is an awfully big plane to be adding extra weight to. My other option is to run a bead of baking soda along the inside and in the gaps, then wet it all with CA glue. That would also be strong and lighter, but more brittle. I'll choose one option tomorrow.

In any case, here's where it is now.




After doing my gap filling, it should be pretty much indistinguishable from the intended airfoil. The LE wouldn't actually have been a pain in the ass if I had done exactly what the plans had intended. This is going to be a big plane. I don't know how much it's going to weigh, but they say a TD is right for it. I have a mint .051 ready for it. Because of the weight, I'm leaning towards the soda and CA idea.

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  ahrma_581 on Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:56 am

Titebond + Monoject

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  SuperDave on Mon Apr 30, 2012 12:30 pm

ahrima:

Thanks for the build report.

Having now completed the "Baby Ringmaster" (sorry no pics available) it appears a simpler design than the "Baby Streak". The LE is pre-formed balsa as is the TE. The TE however must be formed in a "V" shape by separating the TE into two pieces, carefully cutting them to the correct angle then cementing them back together as per the plan.

Have been away from home for the past week visiting Branson, Missouri so the modeling has been in recess.

BTW, saw some of the cyclone damage that visited Branson recently. Most of it has now been repaired and the shows are now backing operation. Branson is a great community were my wife and I enjoyed the genuinely friendly people and show performers who spoke with us personally.

This was our first trip to Branson and it will certainly NOT be our last!

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  RknRusty on Mon Apr 30, 2012 1:11 pm

ahrma_581 wrote:Titebond + Monoject
Bingo! I hadn't thought of that. I've never built with wood glue, but it should be more flexible, strong and hopefully lighter than epoxy. I see a trip to Lowes in my near future. I have one of those curved tip Monoject priming syringes. Thanks, Ahrma.

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  Jobe_Pro on Tue May 01, 2012 2:01 pm

Hey,

I have an old original Baby Flite Streak hanging in the Garage that hasn't flown since the seventies, needs to be re-skined, so I stripped it but noticed the right side of the wing is warpped down from leading edge to to trailing edge mostly at wing tip, is it pssible to steam and clamp to staighten out.

I had a regular Golden Bee on here originally which did not seem to have hardly enough power to fly this plane?

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  SuperDave on Tue May 01, 2012 2:59 pm

Jobe:



Yes, steaming works to remove wing warps. Warping is often caused by the conditions in which the plane was stored like attics with extreme variations in temperature and humidity..

The BFS is a lot of airplane to be hauled around by a GB .049. Consider stepping up the engine type or displacement if you wish better flying performance. Even a TD .049 would do it.

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread, Q&A

Post  Ken Cook on Tue May 01, 2012 3:02 pm

Is the plane covered in silkspan and dope? I've used heat and twisted the wing the opposing wing until you get wrinkles. Hit the wrinkles with the heat until they disappear. You will have wrinkles on the top and bottom of the wing. My heat gun is a higher temp heat gun. I would use caution due to the age. A good practice would be to wave the heat gun back and forth getting close and closer. It could very well split. Obviously stay away and sneak up on it. You surely don't want to set it on fire. I've even gone as far to twist and dope the wing panel with clear. It can be fixed though. If your covered with Monokote this is much easier. If the wing still isn't to your liking you could trim some aluminum from a soda can approx 3/4" wide x 1 1/2" long. Slot the trailing edge and glue the aluminum into the slot with some CA. You now have a trim tab that you can fine tune by bending up or down. Flying right side up then inverted checking to see if the wingtip is high or low will allow you to make the determination. Ken

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  ZACATTACK on Tue May 01, 2012 8:23 pm

So it is OK to use CA on the Rib section of Balsa builds,that is the message here, Correct?? The higher stress regions should get epoxy?? Thanx.

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  RknRusty on Wed May 02, 2012 2:17 am

I'm still working on the wing. Going slow because my son and his entourage came to visit for a couple of days. The lead edge problem is all fixed and test fits into the fuse perfectly. I used Titebond in a Monoject priming syringe to strengthen the joints inside of it.

I almost had a catastrophe, y'all would have laughed your asses off at me if I hadn't reacted quickly enough. I was shrinking some heat shrink tubing around the leadout connection at the bellcrank. I was using a tiny torch, and I nicked a rib with the flame and it started flaming up like flash paper!
affraid Laughing I blew out the flame but the smoldering kept consuming balsa like flesh eating strep. I finally spit on my fingers and pinched it out. Good save. I can imagine me posting to my build log that the whole thing was just a wing skeleton shaped pile of ashes. I cut a new rib-tip and replaced it and it looks like it never happened.

I'll do a little work on it tomorrow and put it on hold. I have hand surgery Thursday and so will probably be out of action for a couple of weeks.


Last edited by RknRusty on Mon Jun 11, 2012 11:46 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  Cribbs74 on Wed May 02, 2012 3:08 am

lol!

Keystone model building!

Good one Rusty, glad it's all sorted. What's the hand surgery for? I assume it's not because you burned your fingers pinching out flames.

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  Ivanhoe on Wed May 02, 2012 4:36 am

Open flame + balsa + glues = Aaaaaaaahhhhhhhhh!!!!!

Never, EVER, get a flame near a model! shrink tubing etc. with a heatgun or a soldering iron

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  RknRusty on Wed May 02, 2012 12:55 pm

Ivanhoe wrote:Open flame + balsa + glues = Aaaaaaaahhhhhhhhh!!!!!
Never, EVER, get a flame near a model! shrink tubing etc. with a heatgun or a soldering iron
Yyyyyyep, I'm thinking that too.

I meant to mention above that I added an extra brace to the bellcrank mount so I don't crack it pulling it out of the stooge like what happened to the Jumpin' Bean.
cribbs74 wrote: lol!

Keystone model building!

Good one Rusty, glad it's all sorted. What's the hand surgery for? I assume it's not because you burned your fingers pinching out flames.
The surgery is for what I hope is carpal tunnel syndrome. For the last 8-10 weeks, I've had no sense of touch and hard tingling. Luckily I have a patch of feeling on the side of my right thumb, so can feel if something is hot, cold, smooth, rough, etc. Sometimes find my hand is empty when I thought I was holding something. It's pretty common in dialysis patients, and if that's really what it is, it should greatly improve. If it works, I'll have the other hand fixed later.

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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

Post  RknRusty on Wed May 09, 2012 1:23 am

Here she is. I'll post a writeup tomorrow.


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Re: Baby Flite Streak build thread

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