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This is how shill-bidding works :)

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This is how shill-bidding works :)

Post  Cox International on Thu Mar 23, 2017 1:56 pm

March 20 @ 11:10:37 hrs we place a bid for $61

n**n places a bid of $43 @ 15:44:17 and is immediately outbid due to our higher bid-by-proxy.

n**n continues to bid in small and very short intervals (seconds) until, finally, @ 15:44:40 (PDT) he has outbid us.

Nothing unusual so far, but then he retracts his bid 49 seconds later. Unless one has previously researched this and possibly bookmarked the "bid retraction" link, it is almost impossible to find it and act in such a short period of time. This led us to believe that this was shilling to drive up the price and then quickly retract to make us the highest bidder at our maximum bid. I mean, if you are bidding in small increments and have finally outbid with a price that you are willing to pay, why would you immediately retract your winning bid?

Now, at the bottom of the image one can see the bid history between seller and bidder. Yep, 100% of that bidders bids have been with that seller, meaning the "bidder" has not placed any bids anywhere else in the past 30 days.



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Re: This is how shill-bidding works :)

Post  Surfer_kris on Thu Mar 23, 2017 2:57 pm

Yes, that is a pretty obvious and disgusting behaviour...

Can you file a report at Ebay?
It should be in their interest too to stop these kind of "traders", or Ebay will quickly collaps...
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Re: This is how shill-bidding works :)

Post  Cox International on Thu Mar 23, 2017 3:27 pm

In the end we were outbid so it did not affect us.

Thought about writing to the seller and / or contacting eBay but then, could be a customer of ours or just simply bad Karma.

eBay has some quite powerful software to catch shilling but it's not too difficult to circumvent if one puts some thought to the process.

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Re: This is how shill-bidding works :)

Post  getback on Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:36 pm

I have seen this a few times and in the beginning thought the same as you and others but now have been thinking just Stupid People !! (( i thought the bay was monitoring things like this ,,, as at the ending i may snipe with my Hi bid , by waiting and watching , but never DRIVE it up Huh...
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Re: This is how shill-bidding works :)

Post  Marleysky on Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:42 pm

Bernie, Thanks for the lesson on Shill bids. I've seen bidders up the price on a number of auctions, a little at a time, heck I'm sure I' VE even done that. But was not aware of the bid retraction portion. I have not learned how to snipe, yet. My most recent attempt to win I bid 5 minutes before the end $25.00 and was winning, last minutes bids went up to over $38 and was won by a sniper at $41, 4 seconds before the end. I also bid on line at a local auction house. They have software that extends the bid ending by 8 to 10 minutes for every bid entered at the last minutes of an auction. I've seen items that should have closed at 9:30pm not end until after 11pm, due to bidding wars between bidders......just like at a live auction. I think it's fair, to give the former high bidder another chance to out bid a competitor, it's good for the seller for sure! lol!
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Re: This is how shill-bidding works :)

Post  smooth_bill on Fri Mar 24, 2017 6:13 pm

I always use an auto bid program, because I'm not on the computer all the time. Works well, but I don't always win. I also set a realistic bid maximum of what I think the item is worth to me.

The bidder mentioned may have set a bid limit too high, and realized his mistake in time to cancel. Takes all kinds to make eBay work.

Bill
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Re: This is how shill-bidding works :)

Post  rsv1cox on Sun Mar 26, 2017 7:09 am

I call them "Nibblers" making the minimum bid multiple times. Only once has someone bid me right up to my proxy max bid.

Like many, I make a single bid related to what the item is worth to me then forget it. If I win, great if I lose also great. If I have the time I watch the auction end out of curiosity and marvel as snipers chip in with their bids. Many times in the last two or three seconds I see bids flash by. Almost as much fun as going to the movies. Smile

Bob
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Re: This is how shill-bidding works :)

Post  GallopingGhostler on Sun Mar 26, 2017 2:19 pm

Because I know specifically what I want and what I don't want, I first look at seller comments. I pass those with less than 99% automatically. There are a few E-Bay sellers who behave as trolls in various model plane forums (truly character challenged. tongue) Those I avoid, even though they may have 100%. Also, I avoid bidding on anything that has inadequate photos to describe their used condition. Huh...

(Bought a few items that had serious flaws in unphotographed portions, like universal mufflers with botched exhaust port cut out and chromed piston badly eroded. Doh!)

Also I avoid those who claim a friend reviewed the item and they are publishing their comments. Sad Goodbye

Those left, I have a price in my mind that I will not go above. Any item that appears to be heavily bidded on exceeding my worth, I don't even attempt.  Smoking

If no one bids, I'll submit. If already a bid, I submit toward the end. If I get, I get, if I don't I don't. Sometimes I've submitted with 10 seconds of end. I don't consider it a game, I don't play those. Sometimes I win, sometimes I don't. More power to the winner. Smile

Sometimes don't even bother with E-Bay, just go directly to a reputable seller and buy their item. I may pay a few more dollars, but I know I will get a quality item, which is far worth not having any hassle. Wink
There's more to life than on-line auctions. RC Plane

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Re: This is how shill-bidding works :)

Post  Cox International on Mon Mar 27, 2017 11:10 am

smooth_bill wrote:I always use an auto bid program, because I'm not on the computer all the time. Works well, but I don't always win. I also set a realistic bid maximum of what I think the item is worth to me.

The bidder mentioned may have set a bid limit too high, and realized his mistake in time to cancel. Takes all kinds to make eBay work.

Bill

No, the bidder bid in $2 increments until he was over our max. bid by $1; after which he retracted. This was deliberate.

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Re: This is how shill-bidding works :)

Post  GallopingGhostler on Mon Mar 27, 2017 1:48 pm

Cox International wrote:No, the bidder bid in $2 increments until he was over our max. bid by $1; after which he retracted. This was deliberate.

Interesting; I thought that except for unusual circumstances, such as seller reveals additional info on the item after bid started that changed its description, that once bid one could not retract their bid. Huh... I've seen hints of what you experienced in the past, where price was driven up by a single bidder. Doh! Sometimes seemed as though a "friend" is working in cahoots with the seller, but was just a suspicion, but I don't work the on-line auctions often enough and more times than not just do immediate buy no bid items. Popcorn

Couple years ago, there was one plans seller, who castigated me for simply asking where's my stuff after 4 or 5 days passed and item hadn't shipped yet. He called me a "troll". That was the last time I bought anything from him. Sad Goodbye

Another E-Bay plans seller called me a troll on Stuka Stunt for reposting information from Brotherhood of the Ring, on engines an elderly CL flier friend of Pat Johnson was selling. I thought there might be some who'd want NOS engines. I'll never buy a plug nickel from him. Mad

It's a jungle with cupcake and snowflake sellers out there. Devil It's been a while since I last bought from your store, but only because where I live, the .049's don't do to well in our majority windier weather and thus don't fly the smaller much. I ordered direct versus E-Bay because it was a lot easier to navigate your store. Hand Shake

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Re: This is how shill-bidding works :)

Post  JPvelo on Wed Mar 29, 2017 7:56 am

I sent a guy a "second chance offer" after my winning bidder backed out. He comes back at me with a lowball offer and details how the guy who backed out had bid 3 or 4 times thereby jacking his auto bid up and he should be able to buy my engine for his first bid.

Gotta love cheapskates...

Jim
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Re: This is how shill-bidding works :)

Post  GallopingGhostler on Wed Mar 29, 2017 9:27 am

Not all have common sense, ethics or proper manners. I like paying bargain prices, but that move by that particular bidder was wrong. tongue

I won a Venus straight soprano saxophone, offered to me as second bidder, which pleased me. Thumbs Up I think I paid $225 for it ($5 less than top bidder) about 5 years ago. (I chose Venus, because I read favourable comments about it. China has excellent manufacturers and a few mediocre ones. It is a good intermediate instrument, plays well in tune, a true jewel. Smoking )

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Re: This is how shill-bidding works :)

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