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Cox Engine of The Month
October-2018
Mudhen's

"Prototype T.D. .010 c.1960"



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World of Aviation

New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  Marleysky on Thu Dec 21, 2017 12:17 pm

WHOO-hoo!.
Sounds like she’s a hand full!  Nice job, I see you’re using the Official “Cox Engine Starting Kit” that’s always a good sign, if nothing else but paying omage to the creator of theses little bundles of joy. Congratulations on a successful, if not Thrilling Maiden flight!  
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  Tee Bee on Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:13 pm

Nice work, Mauricio!
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  getback on Thu Dec 21, 2017 1:19 pm

LOL I hear ya man !! Glad you could ride it out to get trim in before going over the edge , sounds like a great morning before coffee ? But anyway , you get to get a cam hat , head , ear , nose Laughing  something because that first time in the air would have go you enrolled in the aviation save of fame !!
Sorry this is all i got This Site Rocks! Way to go Troy!!!
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  Tee Bee on Thu Dec 21, 2017 2:09 pm

Ha! Thanks!
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  Surfer_kris on Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:19 am

I feel you pain with the Pee Wee...

Out of all the cox engines and models, that one has given the most grief. It seems the production tolerances were simply not good enough for an engine of that size. I don't know if they ever tried to make a .010 in reed and tank style, but they seem to have reached a limit with the .020 size.

40 seconds is similar what I used to get on the pee wee too, perhaps a little longer if I was chasing the needle in a bench run, or set it rich enough at first in order for it to not quit. The length of the ventury part seems to vary a lot (or the seat in the backplate varies, I'm not sure which), and from one tank to another one can have a leak of air/fuel into the venturi or a leak of fuel out of the tank etc.

Some also say that the tank heats up during a run and that could affect the needle setting too. Other say that one cannot run low nitro levels, and so on. I don't know, perhaps it is a combination of everything, and that makes it tricky to get everything just right.

On diesel fuel the Pee Wee runs like a charm, I guess diesel much less sensitive to all the variables, and I don't even need a fuel line on the needle. It will always run until the tank is empty and I get about 2 minutes run on a 6x3 prop.

So I would recommend to try a .020 TD instead, these are much better in terms of handling and run rock steady in comparison. If you an exhaust throttle ring you can adjust power for a suitable flight speed. It takes a while to get use to small planes and it is nice to have the throttle option.
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  Tee Bee on Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:07 am

Yep, I understand. The Pee Wee .020 is about the only Cox engine(besides a Queen Bee or any of the .15s) configuration that I've never attempted to fly because of my bad luck getting them to start and run consistently well. I've always been able to work through the issues and get the others going well enough to enjoy them on a variety of models. I agree about the TD .020. It's one of my favorite Cox engines and really performs! The thing is, I'm already flying those on other airplanes. I set out to build a hotrod plane with which to mount a Pee Wee so I could round things out. I see lots of youtube vids of other people running them in the air successfully, so I know it can be done, though many of them have short run times like mine. I see them flown at the SMALL events occasionally as well. I've experimented with most of the little tricks that others recommend without any luck. Yesterday, I tried 3 styles of props and got the same short runs each time. I plan to cobble together another Pee Wee from old parts to try again. Then I will remove a NIB one from it's package and install new o-rings, fuel line, etc and try that. After that, I will give up if it doesn't work out. I'm not going to struggle for long periods to start a plane's engine at the field to only realistically get to fly it for 20 seconds at a time. As for the throttle, these planes are just too small for that. Everything is a tight squeeze and the .020 version was already getting heavier than I wanted at 4oz. 2-channel operation was the goal on these little guys from the start. I will endeavor to persever a little longer. Smile The little plane itself is a winner, though. I had a ball flying the blue one once I got her trimmed out and tamed down. That was a crazy ride at first but worth it on the following flights!
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  MauricioB on Fri Dec 22, 2017 6:25 am

It is interesting to read these comments, because I did many questions with Pee Wee and I agree with you.
I have sincerely managed to leave them at ease, but I have solved some rules for the engine that go beyond its own manual.
I also think how Surfer_kris, that can be the limit of tolerances and something else that I think is that not all these engines have been armed in the same way with the same components.
For example, in a new Pee Wee, changing the G ring to a smaller one, allowed the valve to work better.
I suppose that with the diesel it works better just and when the valve has the necessary ease and the fuel to be more oily makes the valve itself does not move so much when the engine is running, in turn the same oil helps that there are no or decrease the air sucks by the needle, those are some of the appreciable differences.
There is much much more, I would say that each Pee Wee is very "personal".
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  Tee Bee on Fri Dec 22, 2017 7:09 am

MauricioB wrote:There is much much more, I would say that each Pee Wee is very "personal".

I think you nailed it on the head, Mauricio.  It's an enjoyable hobby most of the time but I do have limits to my time and patience.  I will try to come up with a good running Pee Wee from my available engines and parts but doubt I will be investing in more of them for future use, as other Cox engines have just given me more consistent runs with less effort on my part.

All the best to you guys for assisting me! Hand Shake

I bet 1/2A Nut is hoping I'll just get on with bolting up the TD with a speed prop. lol!
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  getback on Fri Dec 22, 2017 7:43 am

Well this is all new to me not ever have ran a PeeWee but have a couple ? I now have one on a mitsubishi Zero for the traveling engine , i was going to test flight it to see if it would fly worth a crap before mounting the jewel on it ..

I guess i had better get it off the wall and ck. the engine out its a red tank Pee Wee if that matters .
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  Tee Bee on Fri Dec 22, 2017 8:11 am

Yours will surely run great, getting great fuel efficency and emitting your favorite beverage from the exhaust ports. Smile
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  MauricioB on Fri Dec 22, 2017 9:20 am

Tee Bee wrote:

I bet 1/2A Nut is hoping I'll just get on with bolting up the TD with a speed prop. lol!

My friend, do not doubt it! Hahaha Very Happy
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  MauricioB on Fri Dec 22, 2017 9:47 am

This is a video very visited, I made contact with the author, "Damien", (France), he has there placed a 5x2 Graupnner propeller, the most even that I got to try is 5x3 of Cox.

Here is the video of Damien with 5 x 2 (Graupnner)


And mine with 5 x 3 (Cox)
Clarify also, that this Pee Wee has a rear plate Cox helicopter, also modified the diameter of the air intake.




Here is another of my videos with Cox Pee Wee .020 with the perforated tank to receive an Extra deposit.
Propeller Cox 5 x 3
Change of ring G, the original had a larger section diameter and did not let the flaper valve work.
Placement of a piece of neoprene on the carburation needle (to avoid sucking air).
This also has a speed regulation ring made at home.



Last edited by MauricioB on Fri Dec 22, 2017 10:03 am; edited 2 times in total
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  Tee Bee on Fri Dec 22, 2017 9:57 am

I think by replacing the tank with the backplate, most of the troubles are eliminated.  I wish there was a factory or aftermarket alternative backplate made for the Pee Wee besides the heli version which are hard to find.
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  1/2A Nut on Fri Dec 22, 2017 9:23 pm

I may be able to get some CNC horse shoe style back plates made.
The challenge here is the NV assembly. It's one thing to rob the original
NV the next trick is fabricating a brass spray bar for it.

Yesterday some offerings was sent to me to test:
TD .010 and TD .020 aluminum back plates.
If they bench well the vendor will then move forward to sell to the masses.
I will post a link as to where to buy them at that time and post vid results.

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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  MauricioB on Sat Dec 23, 2017 12:04 am

1/2A Nut wrote:I may be able to get some CNC horse shoe style back plates made.
The challenge here is the NV assembly. It's one thing to rob the original
NV the next trick is fabricating a brass spray bar for it.

Yesterday some offerings was sent to me to test:
TD .010 and TD .020 aluminum back plates.
If they bench well the vendor will then move forward to sell to the masses.
I will post a link as to where to buy them at that time and post vid results.

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Small Cox Logo Small Cox Logo That's a very good friend! ... cheers Clapping
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  MauricioB on Sat Dec 23, 2017 12:25 am

Hello Tee Bee, here at this moment it's 2:40 in the morning (AM), my neighbors are sleeping !!, so I should not make noise ... but a little ... mmmm is not bad !, haha .... I wanted to share this video that I made for you, so you can see how the Cox Pee Wee .020 "custom" regulates, I can not accelerate because my neighbors really sleep, but hardly varied the rim by means of the RC engine it responds perfectly
I hope you like it as a gear, the propeller a Cox 5 x 3 and if you see it starts by hand, without the spring :-)



Very Happy  To march to the Pee Wee, to this hour and to take a glass of well frozen beer, it is a pleasure great! .... :-) ..... I do not know for my neighbors haha  Beer Cheers



Last edited by MauricioB on Sat Dec 23, 2017 12:36 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  MauricioB on Sat Dec 23, 2017 12:34 am

I'm still working, I already have 5 speed adjustment rings for .020 ... I must stop, yes, I must stop! :-), my eyes do not give anymore!

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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  Tee Bee on Sat Dec 23, 2017 4:06 am

Great work, Mauricio! You are obsessed in a good way.

1/2A Nut, that's good news regarding the backplate setups. Keep us posted on progress.

Yesterday, I spent some time on youtube watching people fly Pee Wees with the OEM tanks. Most of them ran 35-55 seconds just like mine! Some of the ones with longer flights were obviously edited with several cuts of shorter runs. Looks like my setup is working as well as it can. When I get past this overtime, I may try to get in some short flights with it when i can arrange a helper to launch it for me to trim out. I will eventually need to revisit the idea of installing a larger tank in the fuse and a backplate mount when one is available. I don't really want to run an auxillary tank in addition to the Cox tank as my CG is already a tad too forward as it is. The exfra weight up front would worsen that and I don't want to increase the total weight any more. This small, short coupled plane has limitations for gear placement. I bet with a backplate mount and one of those awesome 1/2A Nut tanks, it would come out just right!
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  MauricioB on Sat Dec 23, 2017 11:02 am

Tee Bee wrote:Great work, Mauricio!  You are obsessed in a good way.!

I have seen many videos also when I started with 020, since I could not have a reliable march either.
I began to try different tests, because it is not easy here to get parts, some I had to make them by hand, G-rings, flaper valves and regulating rings, all that led me to understand better and make decisions that would be error-proof, I spent whole weeks at 020, about to get tired, but finally I managed to make a summary taking note of each of the tests and achieve the goal.
It is certain that many of these engines, work well from the beginning, but many others being new have made renege, just making fine adjustments the engine works very well.
It is common for example in most, having to put neoprene on the needle, but not all need a change of the ring G, or fit the valve flapper, or change together between tank and carter, that is, when someone asks me for their 020 , there are many alternatives to consider, maybe an aeromodelista without time or without some knowledge, leave it there in a drawer, for not being able to enjoy it.
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  Tee Bee on Sat Dec 23, 2017 11:19 am

Mauricio, I have enjoyed watching the vids of your .020 flying. I'm sure many others have also appreciated your efforts. Your enthusiasm for this niche of the hobby shows well and is even more obvious when you try these projects for yourself! Much like an experienced musician can better appreciate a well-played song than someone who has never picked up an instrument.
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  MauricioB on Sat Dec 23, 2017 11:31 am

Tee Bee wrote:Mauricio, I have enjoyed watching the vids of your .020 flying.  I'm sure many others have also appreciated your efforts.  Your enthusiasm for this niche of the hobby shows well and is even more obvious when you try these projects for yourself!  Much like an experienced musician can better appreciate a well-played song than someone who has never picked up an instrument.  

Thank you friend for your words, on purpose as is your name (I would like to call you by your name).
Look here I leave you a video of mine enjoying two Pee Wee at once! ...

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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  MauricioB on Sat Dec 23, 2017 9:17 pm

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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  Tee Bee on Sat Dec 23, 2017 9:27 pm

Hmmm. Thanks, Mauricio.
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Tee Stik Video!

Post  Tee Bee on Tue Jan 09, 2018 8:02 pm

Following some requests, I finally got around to mounting my GoPro on a hat. Here is the TD .010 Tee Stik flying under an overcast sky this afternoon. I still haven't flown the Pee Wee .020 version due to the very limited engine run time it has with the stock tank. Someday...

Turn it up and enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=btmQkLnpMKM&feature=youtu.be
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

Post  MauricioB on Tue Jan 09, 2018 8:30 pm

Tee Bee wrote:Following some requests, I finally got around to mounting my GoPro on a hat.  Here is the TD .010 Tee Stik flying under an overcast sky this afternoon.  I still haven't flown the Pee Wee .020 version due to the very limited engine run time it has with the stock tank.  Someday...

Turn it up and enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=btmQkLnpMKM&feature=youtu.be

Friend looks great, a great flight !!, congratulations!
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Re: New TD .010 and Pee Wee .020 Planes

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