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Scientific "Zipper" Build...The Zipper Gets Some Thursday Attention Babe_b10
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Post  Kim on Tue Apr 07, 2020 11:16 am

So, Bob's one little, though enthusiastic, comment about his fondness for Walt Musciano's 1/2A "Zipper" was just enough to push me over the edge into starting one.  Went to bed thinking about it...drank coffee this morning thinking about it, so what the heck...

I built the original Scientific kit back in 1969 or so, powering it with the Babe Bee from my PT-19 QZ.  A couple decades ago, I got a copy of the plan sheet, along with a nice note from the Man himself, Mr. Musciano.  Been talking about building it since then.

Now, in the midst of a shop totally cluttered with tapes, dope cans, and spray equipment, I've started cutting templates from the 10% enlarged copies I made from the original plan sheet.  I wanted this Zipper to be a bit larger, as I remembered the original to be better suited for a healthy .020, instead of the Babe Bee that took it around the circle like a combat wing.

Anyway, we'll see how this goes along.  So far, the whole "Social Distancing" thing has turned the shop and front yard into a booming model airplane flying, dope spraying, resurrection of stalled projects, and engine test-running affair.

Everybody take care and stay healthy,
Dopey Hermit Kim

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Last edited by Kim on Thu Apr 23, 2020 1:37 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Post  Marleysky on Tue Apr 07, 2020 12:18 pm

Now, THAT is AWESOME! cheers
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Post  rsv1cox on Tue Apr 07, 2020 12:32 pm

Ecstatic Kim Ecstatic. Perhaps the most memorable model that I have ever built and I can't explain why.

10% you say. I wonder is Kinkos or Staples is open. Smile I'm going to give it a try.

It must be great to have original hand-written correspondence from the man himself.

Got out the magnifying glass, looks like I powered mine with just a 5cc Babe Bee.

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Post  Ken Cook on Tue Apr 07, 2020 12:46 pm

Kim, I've been doing the same thing here. I'm trying to keep a balance between house repairs. I painted the dining room, stripped a very ornate door that has a circle top within it and repainted it, electrical switches and bathroom fan repaired as well. So it was off to the shop, if the virus doesn't get me, the dope fumes will. I rebuilt a older combat plane all covered in silk, this was a real difficult plane to repair without making it look bad but I managed. Your Zipper should be neat to see flying.
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Post  Kim on Tue Apr 07, 2020 1:50 pm

rsv1cox wrote:Ecstatic Kim Ecstatic.  Perhaps the most memorable model that I have ever built and I can't explain why.

10% you say.  I wonder is Kinkos or Staples is open.  Smile  I'm going to give it a try.

It must be great to have original hand-written correspondence from the man himself.  

Got out the magnifying glass, looks like I powered mine with just a 5cc Babe Bee.  

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Do It Man!!!!!

The 10% is just my W.A.G.  Thinking now that it might have been the flat-bottom wing, cranking out lift as the Babe Bee hauled it around.  I remember it wanting to ride high in the circle (how or why do I remember all this crap so well!!???), and trying to "tuck" with down commands, but having a sweet glide to landing once the engine quit, which, a lot of time is just as important to me as the rest of it's flying.

Just looking freehand at the plan sheet, that Bee DOES look rather monstrous compared to the airframe, and all of these kits were wild performers on healthy .049's!

Yes, getting the note from Mr. Musciano was fantastic, and it kills me now that I didn't send him an invitation to lunch so I could have met him.  Nerds will go to great lengths to meet their Heroes!


Last edited by Kim on Wed Apr 08, 2020 8:58 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post  Kim on Tue Apr 07, 2020 1:57 pm

Ken Cook wrote:             Kim, I've been doing the same thing here. I'm trying to keep a balance between house repairs. I painted the dining room, stripped a very ornate door that has a circle top within it and repainted it, electrical switches and bathroom fan repaired as well. So it was off to the shop, if the virus doesn't get me, the dope fumes will. I rebuilt a older combat plane all covered in silk, this was a real difficult plane to repair without making it look bad but I managed. Your Zipper should be neat to see flying.

Yeah Man!   My front yard is currently about 1/8th mowed, as I take breaks from the important stuff for a few moments of responsible behavior!!!  

Good news for my old push-mower is that, due to my not knowing WHAT the heck is gonna happen this summer, I've granted it a reprieve from being named "Guest of Honor" at our next Gun Day!  Gonna nurse it along for another season.
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Post  Kim on Tue Apr 07, 2020 4:09 pm

Yo Bob...and anyone else with this affliction...

Just got back from Staples, they had the copy machines closed off, but I was able show the girl what I needed.

From the 10% enlarged plans, the rib profile is right at 3.9". If you enlarge the little top view by 392%, you'll get a plan-view of the wing and tail feathers that's a close match to the full size 10%+ profile.
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Post  944_Jim on Tue Apr 07, 2020 6:33 pm

I'm sure several here will know of my Scientific obsession. So I'm all eyes and ears as this one goes together.
What is the plan for scaling up the plastic turtleneck? I'm guessing a wood blank, a 2-liter pop bottle and a hair dryer.
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Post  Kim on Tue Apr 07, 2020 6:52 pm

944_Jim wrote:I'm sure several here will know of my Scientific obsession. So I'm all eyes and ears as this one goes together.
What is the plan for scaling up the plastic turtleneck? I'm guessing a wood blank, a 2-liter pop bottle and a hair dryer.

Yes...already got a plank of soft balsa set aside for the turtle deck.  I happen to have several small canopies (from somewhere), and one may be close, if not, I've been wanting to try that deal with the pop bottle/heat gun!


Last edited by Kim on Tue Apr 07, 2020 11:02 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post  Cribbs74 on Tue Apr 07, 2020 10:44 pm

Neat project Kim, I have never flown anything with tricycle gear, well at least CL anyway. I am sure the only thing different is the landing.

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Post  Ken Cook on Wed Apr 08, 2020 8:14 am

Ron, trike gear on a 1/2A typically equates to cartwheeling on grass. It can be very difficult to land as they don't glide in tail down to grease the landing in. I learned to fly with trike gear on a Midwest P-63 48" version and still own that plane. Touch and go's are quite impressive especially when coming out of a loop. The trike gear works much better on larger stuff but you do suffer a bit of penalty with drag. The other issue with trike gear on a 1/2A is that the stance of the mains is generally close together. This can be rather tippy from side to side and many of the Musciano models suffer from this. The Cessna 182 is very bad, the mains are too long and too close together in width and length making for a very unstable plane. Walt essentially did this for the cool factor which he succeeded at.
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Post  rsv1cox on Wed Apr 08, 2020 8:29 am

I had to scan mine to get a better look, early photograph 60's something. May be the original or subsequent rebuild, don't know but think it's the original because I painted the rebuild in white/red if I can find it. Dope and tissue and painted when I had a steady hand.

Checked my supplies, I have a very similar canopy that should work. Also period correct bell cranks, control horns, wheels, and tissue just no dope.

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Post  getback on Wed Apr 08, 2020 9:19 am

This should bee Good 2 2 2 builds in one This Site Rocks!
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Post  Kim on Wed Apr 08, 2020 9:30 am

COOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!   That one goes in the "Zipper Album"!

I want to do the box art on this one.  My original was a case of "Coat of Many Colors" as,  proportionately, Aerogloss dope was just as expensive in 1969 as Brodak's is today, and the color I had was the color that got used!!

I'm rummaging too, don't have the original bellcrank yet, but Do have the little metal "wrap around" control horn that you push onto the leading edge of the elevator with some glue.  And...I THINK I may have the original plastic spinner...or at least one that's close.

My original Zipper's last act on this earth was trying to fly with a kid-level installation of a "Fly-by-Night" kit from A.H.C.  I don't remember (perhaps intentionally) exactly what happened, as my memory jumps directly to a scene of carnage.  Safe to say, Night Flying would not occur successfully 'till a LONG time later!

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Post  Kim on Wed Apr 08, 2020 9:32 am

getback wrote:This should bee Good 2 2 2 builds in one  This Site Rocks!

"Double the Silliness...Double the Fun"!!!!
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Post  duaneh on Wed Apr 08, 2020 1:35 pm

Wow, Kim, what a neat project.
I never had a Zipper, but did build this Scientific Mustang, which I think uses the exact same wing.
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Hmmm.. 10%, you say? You're giving me ideas...
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Post  NEW222 on Wed Apr 08, 2020 1:48 pm

I know I've said and offered it before, but just in case some may have not seen it, if you want or need any plans upscaled and tiled, please pm me with details and I can do that for you then send right back in both full size and tiled versions so you can print out at home druing these times, or any other. Or in case of an oops moment, you can just print out what you need when you need it.
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Post  Kim on Wed Apr 08, 2020 2:06 pm

NEW222 wrote:I know I've said and offered it before, but just in case some may have not seen it, if you want or need any plans upscaled and tiled, please pm me with details and I can do that for you then send right back in both full size and tiled versions so you can print out at home druing these times, or any other. Or in case of an oops moment, you can just print out what you need when you need it.

That's Great! Thank You
!
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Post  Kim on Wed Apr 08, 2020 2:07 pm

duaneh wrote:Wow, Kim, what a neat project.
I never had a Zipper, but did build this Scientific Mustang, which I think uses the exact same wing.
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Hmmm.. 10%, you say? You're giving me ideas...

Looks just like it! This would be another great project for some of the craftsmen here !!!!
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Post  944_Jim on Thu Apr 09, 2020 10:56 pm

Threadjack: Since you guys are showing these, and knowing how that flat plate wing flies, I've been tempted to kitbash a Guillow's 19" Typhoon onto a slightly reduced Wido Satan wing. The hope is for a similarly sized model, but better flying. What say y'all?
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Post  getback on Fri Apr 10, 2020 6:39 am

I am interested in where you get the Rib pattern from ?
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Post  rsv1cox on Fri Apr 10, 2020 6:42 am

944_Jim wrote:Threadjack: Since you guys are showing these, and knowing how that flat plate wing flies, I've been tempted to kitbash a Guillow's 19" Typhoon onto a slightly reduced Wido Satan wing. The hope is for a similarly sized model, but better flying. What say y'all?

Worthy project Jim; anything will fly from toilet seats to witches on broomsticks, but how well.  This fellow does great with a Parkzone..

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=guillows+typhoon&docid=608033812435504954&mid=3F3012E018FB37F1C0B23F3012E018FB37F1C0B2&view=detail&FORM=VIRE

Or...……

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=guillows+typhoon&&view=detail&mid=8F3A8E6FF0984262C01F8F3A8E6FF0984262C01F&rvsmid=3F3012E018FB37F1C0B23F3012E018FB37F1C0B2&FORM=VDMCNR

Kits are on ebay from $10 on up.  Go for it and join the club.
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Post  Kim on Fri Apr 10, 2020 7:24 am

944_Jim wrote:Threadjack: Since you guys are showing these, and knowing how that flat plate wing flies, I've been tempted to kitbash a Guillow's 19" Typhoon onto a slightly reduced Wido Satan wing. The hope is for a similarly sized model, but better flying. What say y'all?

I say it's time for some Typhoon balsa dust!!!!!!!!!!!!!! cheers cheers cheers cheers cheers
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Post  Kim on Fri Apr 10, 2020 9:36 am

Been splitting time between Zipper and a cowling for the Scientific Thunderbird, and mowing the yard a few small sections at a time.  I can't hope to do as fantastic a job as Jim did on his Thunderbird, but am gonna give a shot.

Also, decided to up the thickness of the Zipper's tail feathers, since 1/16th seems a little thin and prone to warping.  Don't really know what I was thinking, but cut some out last night from 1/8th sheet, and now think this is too thick...so gonna gear down to 3/32---got a good sheet stuck away somewhere.

Anyway, ought to have a basic frame sitting on the desk by tonight.

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Post  Kim on Sat Apr 11, 2020 7:22 pm

So, got distracted by a stupid search for a comet that had me staring at the heavens 'till 10pm. Finally got cold enough to give up.

So now, back to working on the Zipper...figure to do the wing first and trying REAL hard not to change anything, but it's gonna happen anyway.

The original has no sheeting on it's wing's center-section, with the fuse just glued to it. I wanted a "lip" of sheeting to protrude on either side of the fuse to make it easier to fix or recover down the road. So, it got a extra rib 3/4" out on each side, supporting some 3/32 sheeting.

I'm having a "slow night" as far as brain activity, and this is as far as I've gotten. Slow going, but haven't yet made mistakes that a new exacto blade can't fix !

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