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Post  DanMc Mon Apr 26, 2021 10:39 pm

Hello Everyone!
I have another small Wen-Mac model to get cleaned up and out of the way, a Corsair, and I think I have heard them referred to as a Yellow Jacket. I have another one that is a pale yellow with a decal on it that says Yellow Jacket. This one is a chromes version and has the throttle or multi speed attachment. The model is all there, and in one piece, it's just a sticky, gooey mess! The chrome is coming off, and more may come off as I try to clean it, but I don't have plans right now to do anything about that. getting it apart is the issue right now!
I have some pics here of the model and some of the engine. The engine is the issue. It looks like it's supposed to come straight out the bottom. There is something getting in the way, and it looks like it's a small ridge of plastic on both sides of the engine that are interfering with the larger fins of the throttle assembly. I guess it's the throttle assembly! I have not had one of these before. The obvious solution is to unscrew the cylinder and remove that, and the rest will fall out. But I can't get the cylinder to turn, and it's also obvious that heat will be needed to help with that. But if I heat the engine even with a monokote heat gun, I'm libel to damage the otherwise decent fuselage. It's also almost impossible to hold the engine. Can anyone shed some light on this subject. I'll continue to fiddle with it.Wen-Mac Corsair 20210410
Wen-Mac Corsair 20210411
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Post  Marleysky Tue Apr 27, 2021 1:13 pm

Nice model! First - be extra careful on the fuel line and nipple on the gas tank, they break off way to easily.
Second, yeah getting the engine out looks to be a Tuffy! Trying to turn/twist the cylinder from above, while not being able to hold the engine tight will just break the motor mount. You are not gonna have access to the area where the cylinder is stuck to the crankcase. My thoughts would be to put a few drops of Bobs favorite RemOil or some other penetrating oil on the top of the piston&cylinder then a few more down the intake, if the prop driver can be turned, turn it to where the intake hole is facing up and fill the crankcase with it (oil) .....let it soak and do its job. Overnight if possible. Then wrap a leather strap around the top of the cylinder and gently apply twisting force with a pair of medium size Channel Lok pliers. NOTE: If the piston is stuck and won’t go up and down in the cylinder Do Not try to turn the cylinder.....you will twist and shear the Con Rod!
If that doesn’t work plan B would be to fill crankcase with penetrating oil, then apply heat to the crankcase using a pencil tip soldering iron (mine is a Old WEN soldering gun)
First to get the piston broke free, then to heat the old castor locking the cylinder to the crankcase. Use the soldering gun tip inserted down the intake while keeping a finger on the bottom or back of the crankcase to keep the “heat” from getting too hot to melt the plastic, but warm enough to soften the old castor, your finger will tell you if it gets too hot!! Sorta like putting the engine in the oven, when you can’t get the engine in the over! Then once again wrap the top of the cylinder with leather strap and gently twist with channel loc pliers to turn the cylinder free.
That’s my two cents worth!
oooh, secondary brain fart... use a stiff wood prop or something made to fit tighten onto the prop drive plate to give ya some leverage on holding the engine while torquing on the cylinder, so ya don’t break the plastic fuse.
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Post  DanMc Tue Apr 27, 2021 1:24 pm

Thanks for the comments. In my experience with these Wen-Mac engines, the coil on the started and the sprag or clutch mechanism get really stuck and need a generous heating with a monokote gun and oiling as you go to work things loose. I had thought of trying to use a soldering iron but didn't think I would be able to get enough heart transfer. I think some one really ran this thing a lot as it is just covered with goo. I think the engine will have to come out to really get it loose and not damage the clutch. I think I can shave the plastic ribs that the cylinder is interfering with. I don't know why they are there other than maybe to take the abuse of the exhaust gasses. I find it hard to believe that they would assemble the top end of the engine at the factory after the bottom end was installed, but maybe so.
Any insight into how the throttle works will be appreciated also for once I do get it apart.
Thanks again,
Dan McEntee
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Post  Marleysky Tue Apr 27, 2021 1:34 pm

Those “Throttle assemblies “ have a spring and wire lever with a attaching snap ring:

Wen-Mac Corsair E2d1e110
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Post  Marleysky Tue Apr 27, 2021 2:07 pm

OK! ! Easy as Pie!   The Throttle Clip keeps the Throttle sleeve from sliding down too far on cylinder. The Throttle Lever wraps around the sleeve and pokes through the little hole in the sleeve and sticks in just enough to hold the sleeve in place by the wire protruding into the exhaust opening. If you can use a exacto knife or thin blade screwdriver to pry the end of the Throttle Lever away from the cylinder.....the whole sleeve should slide UP and off the top of the cylinder. them your engine should drop down out of the motor mount! !   TAA DAA !


Last edited by Marleysky on Tue Apr 27, 2021 2:08 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : spell ck)
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Post  DanMc Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:27 pm

WOW!! That looks like everything I needed to know! I went to mow the lawn, shoot the breeze with my big brother a bit, then took a nap. I would have never thought, from looking at the engine , that the throttle sleeve came off the top. I have all the wire bits removed from the engine already. I tried turning the sleeve already also with no luck. But, I may be able to carefully heat the top of the cylinder with the narrow nozzle that comes with the heat guns and that may transfer enough heat to the sleeve area. That diagram has been a big help, along with your thoughts, and it is much appreciated!! I have been thinking that when I get it apart and all cleaned up I may try some of this new spray chrome paint that is on the market now to restore the air frame, but first things first. First it has to come apart and then has to get squeaky clean!! Thanks again for all the help!

Dan
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Post  rsv1cox Tue Apr 27, 2021 5:18 pm

You have a gem there, well used and appreciated by it's previous owner. It's not some pristine hangar queen. It has been enjoyed.

Beware of heat and solvents on that plastic fuselage. You will lose finish when you clean but that doesn't seem to upset you. Warm Simple Green will safely remove that grime, but it won't be easy. Nothing worthwhile never is. Chances are whatever you choose to refinish it with won't be fuel proof especially the chomes and silvers. You may have to top coat it if you plane to fly it.

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Post  DanMc Tue Apr 27, 2021 8:17 pm

SUCCESS!!! Marleysky, I owe you a big time favor and the creators of the forum for having it here!! I've got a lot of oddball stuff but not much in the way of documentation and paper work like that exploded view. That really explains a lot. I was able to use a heat gun with the narrow nozzle attached to angle it away from the fuselage and just heat the top of the cylinder. I had a finger pressed against the bottom of the cranks case and before too long I could feel it getting hot. I was surprised it transferred heat that fast and that well. I took a pair of pliers and wiggled the throttle sleeve and it came loose, and came off the top like you said and the exploded view shows. Then the engine came out of the bottom.
I wasn't too sure what or if I was going to do anything with this model because it was it was so cruddy. But as I was looking at it recently, I could tell that it was very complete, nothing missing. How often does that happen!!?? So right now, I am just going to get as clean as possible in case I want too apply some sort of chrome coating, but at a minimum, I will service everything, and get it 100% operable. Even with the chrome finish deteriorated like it is, it still presents well, I think and is still in an original condition that way. Sometimes patina is pretty cool!!! And you can restore something over and over, but it's only original once. I'm posting some pictures here of it apart, and one picture is of some easy cleaning on the right wing to show how cruddy the thing was. Other pictures will show the engine as far as I have it apart, including the starter spring and clutch mechanism if people have never seen one. The prop drive washer comes off and exposes the spring and clutch mechanism. It's not as simple and the Cox spring, but still pretty simple and well engineered. The sprag/clutch mechanism is in the drive washer. It looks like s solid piece of metal but it is a hollow, pressed metal assembly and it fills with oil, and after sitting, can get crusty also. It you try and force the cranks shaft to turn and that mechanism is still locked up, you will break the spring, most likely at the rivet on the clutch hub. I have done this and successfully repaired them also. Tediously difficult but possible. It's going to be a crappy, rainy day tomorrow so I'm going to let the air frame soak over night and work on a thorough cleaning tomorrow. While this is all going on, I may have to decide if I want to fly this or not!!
Thanks again for the help!!! MUCH appreciated.!!
DanWen-Mac Corsair Wen-ma10
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Wen-Mac Corsair Empty Wen-Mac Corsair/Yellow Jacket : Mission Accomplished

Post  DanMc Wed Apr 28, 2021 8:19 pm

Just updating this story. After getting the throttle sleeve loose and off the engine, it came right out of the airplane. I set the air frame in a tub of warm water and Dawn dish washing soap to soak over night. While that was soaking, I worked on cleaning up the engine. The spring starter and clutch mechanism in the prop drive plate were extremely cruddy and packed with dried castor oil scum. I have pulled apart and cleaned countless .049 engines in my time and have dealt with the typical mess left behind from their operation. In recent years I have worked on some that were above and beyond the cruddy and sticky that I have ever seen before, this one included. it makes me wonder what kinds of fuel some people were running in these things, and what kind of oil was in it.
Anyhow, this is such a simple model, that I decided to just clean everything and put it all back together while I looked into some of the new spray chrome paints, or decide to just keep it as it is. I got the engine clean and operating, the clutch and rotomatic starter working well, and the throttle sleeve and related parts figured out, cleaned up and installed after putting the engine back in the airplane. I forgot to take a picture of the return spring mechanism before I stripped it down and had to work that out, but I think I have it correct. With no other repairs to be made, I declare it ready to take it's honorable place hanging from the ceiling in the basement. I'll decide later on the finish. I appreciate the help and information on this little project and hope I can return the favor in the future. Here is a picture or two of it now.
Type at you later,
Dan McEntee


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Post  Oldenginerod Wed Apr 28, 2021 9:13 pm

Come on Dan, you gotta try and get her in the air, at least once!
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Post  Marleysky Wed Apr 28, 2021 9:52 pm

Dan, I think the plane looks great as is, cleaned up and ready for display! I thinks in automotive circles she’d be considered a “survivor “ without any cracks, damage or missing parts but 100% functional. Use your personal preferences as to what or how much you want to refurbish. Glad to be able to help.
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Post  rsv1cox Thu Apr 29, 2021 5:59 am

@Marleysky wrote:Dan, I think the plane looks great as is, cleaned up and ready for display! I thinks in automotive circles she’d be considered a “survivor “ without any cracks, damage or missing parts but 100% functional. Use your personal preferences as to what or how much you want to refurbish. Glad to be able to help.

I was thinking the same thing Rene, "Patina" the purists call it.  Maybe it's the photographs but it looks perfect.  I have never seen that red clip before that goes over the fuel nipples and provides a base for the throttle spring.  Neat.
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Post  getback Thu Apr 29, 2021 9:10 am

Plane looks Great Dan !! I agree no paint , if you fly it do you have a three line handle with a trigger for throttle ? I was scoping some on eBay , the Jroberts and should have bought the first on for 20- + ship one i was bidding on went to 44- and some change , guy has one still on for 85. but has the wire set too $ Airplane
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Post  DanMc Thu Apr 29, 2021 9:46 am

Good Morning Group;
Thanks for the comments. The lighting in my basement isn't the best so I hope the photos tell some kind of story. The main thing that would make me want to restore the finish is the way the wings looked when I was cleaning it and polished them a bit, and I could imagine the whole airplane looking like that! Possibly flying it in it's current state is a possibility also. The tank area is in good shape and fully intact. Even the original fuel line is pretty soft and supple yet and I put it back on. I forgot to take a photo of the airplane before taking it apart and could not remember a thing about how the throttle was assembled. I was amazed that it was all still there, but I think all the sticky castor residue helped out with keeping it stuck on. The diagram that Marleysky posted really help me sort the throttle sleeve out, and I just flip flopped that red bracket around until things made sense. I think it can all go together only one way and work properly. The spring should hold the throttle close , and pulling on the line should open it. The plastic bracket looks like it could fly off at some point either in a hard landing or crash, so I think I'll whip up some kind of retainer, or maybe even just a dab of clear silicone to glue it on and can still be removed later. I have some J-Roberts three line handles, and I think even some kind of Cox unit with a throttle trigger, I'll have to look. In old promotional videos that I have seen by Wen-Mac, the operator just held a separate line for the throttle. That is a lot of engine for such a small airframe so the throttle may be pretty useful if I fly it! I have flown some of my other Cox models such as a Stuka, and the old Super Cub and the videos of those are on Youtube, so flying it won't be a problem, just gotta decide to do it or not. It was a fun little project that just needed to be done to get it out of the way as I work to clean up, clear out and organize things in retirement. Next up are some Wen-Mac Dauntless projects and then I will be liquidating some parts and air frames. Just way too much stuff that I have accumulated and really won't need so might as well make them available to others. I'm trying NOT to add the the menagerie but recently another Cox Spitfire and a Dauntless tempted me too much, and I considered them a rescue!! In the near future I will be posting some picture in a "Tour" thread to show off some stuff. I have been taking the pictures, just need to devote the time to the thread and post them. I've been a member here for a long time but never had much time for computer stuff, so now is the time to catch up and share some stuff. Thanks again everyone for the help and comments!!
Type at you later,
Dan McEntee
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Post  944_Jim Thu Apr 29, 2021 9:00 pm

Mr. Dan,

That is a really remarkable turn-around on an unusual model!

The Roberts three line handle is a smidge too big for this airplane. Well, really quite a bit too big.

Jump back to classifieds on SH. Mr. Dalton Hammett has an ad for some goodies. I'd post the link directly, but if I did then the 3-line Cox handle will sell before you find it. This is the handle sold to match up to the Ryan .020-powered model (usually seen in white/blue).

I've bought from Dalton several times in the last year. Good prices, good wares, good packing/shipping. If I didn't already have a Cox 3-line handle I would own his now.
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Post  DanMc Thu Apr 29, 2021 10:18 pm

Hi Jim;
   Thanks for the heads up. I'll have to check that out. I think I have one that is new in package, but will have to dig it out. Might be easier to buy Dalton's. He's a good guy and I have done a lt f deals with him on eBay. I'll head over there now and check it out.
 Thanks again!!
 Dan

PS, It wasn't much of a project, and that's why I decided to just do it. Hardly any parts at all to this airplane. The air frame is three pieces I think. Then the engine and throttle parts. The one picture shows just about everything!!
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