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Post  rsv1cox Mon Apr 18, 2022 8:36 am

Completion of the three-plane loft rescue.

PT-19, no problems.  Already had cleaned the engine and repaired the tail skid. Just had to remove the single strand steel lead outs.  

A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1013001

A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1012989

Corsair, a different story.  Last time I flew it I didn't clean it at all, unusual for me.  Not even a Remoil flush.  Engine stuck solid, sticky castor holding parts together, and an expired stink bug made disassembly unpleasant.  Heat loosened the engine but not much.  Stiff and would not loosen up.  Been there, gummy sticky castor in the crank shaft relief.

A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1012991
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1012990
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1012992

Fuel tank probably a mess inside.  Simple Green immersion and look for bubbles.

A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1012995
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1012994
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1012993

Crank shaft gummed up.  Oil galley in the case too, pipe cleaner folded in half with Simple Green works well to clean it.  

A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1012997
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1012996
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1012998

Finished

A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1012999
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1013000

Side loader Cox F4U on it's way.  You don't see these as often as you do with the upright engine.  I'm not sure which came first.  

A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader Side_e11
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader Side_e10
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Post  bottomgun Thu Apr 21, 2022 4:34 pm

The side cylinder models came first. I had a Thompson Trophy corsair in 1971 that my mother got me from her S&H Greenstamps catalog.
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Post  rsv1cox Thu Apr 21, 2022 4:45 pm

bottomgun wrote:The side cylinder models came first. I had a Thompson Trophy corsair in 1971 that my mother got me from her S&H Greenstamps catalog.

Thanks, thought that might be the case.  When I was a youngster in the Navy and going to school in Norman Oklahoma I got to start one.  Unforgettable experience to see that big propeller rotating and feel the whole plane shaking.  

A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader Corsai14

Won this parts auction last night for one of each.

A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader Corsai15
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader Corsai16
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Post  bottomgun Thu Apr 21, 2022 6:08 pm

The top one is a side cylinder from about the mid seventies when they repositioned the bell crank to exit out of the side of the fuselage instead of below the wing on the earlier models.
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Post  rsv1cox Fri Apr 22, 2022 10:08 am

bottomgun wrote:The top one is a side cylinder from about the mid seventies when they repositioned the bell crank to exit out of the side of the fuselage instead of below the wing on the earlier models.

Thanks,  They look new.  I have enough engines to out fit them.  No mention of bell cranks though, but easy enough to fashion.  

Got these yesterday, I think they are Carl Goldberg models but I'm not sure.  Perhaps a P-40 and Piper Cub.  Pictured with a Walt Musciano hollow-log Stunt master that I got in similar condition, new tail, replacement wing parts.  Strange fuel transfer system.  

Sellers pictures

A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader Ebay_c19


 A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader Goldbe12
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader Goldbe13

Lousy pictures taken with my Nikon Coolpix L120.  My old school Olympus uses Smart Media and the adapted sim card ready went on the fritz yesterday.

A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader Dscn1826
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader Dscn1825
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Post  GallopingGhostler Fri Apr 22, 2022 1:54 pm

rsv1cox wrote:Got these yesterday, I think they are Carl Goldberg models but I'm not sure.  Perhaps a P-40 and Piper Cub.

A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader Ebay_c19

The Piper is a Sterling Kit# S-36, Beginner's Super Cub (20.5" W/S). It is a later kit, don't know when they replaced the stamped 2 piece aluminum sheet metal engine mount and elevator control horn (and probably bellcrank) with nylon. When I bought my S-37, Beginner's E-III Eindecker in late 1972, it came with the aluminum engine mount, bellcrank and control horn.

Could be wrong, but 2nd may be a Midwest P-40 profile kit. Midwest liked to extend their profile fuselages to cover the underside of the engine with the cowling profile, plus AFAIK they used a plastic engine mount similar to Sterling Beginners series. Goldberg instead preferred to use a plywood bulkhead with balsa block fairings behind for a smoother look.

Carl Goldberg's profile kits seemed to be slightly more polished for a cleaner look, whereas Sterling and Midwest were more utilitarian.

Top Flite at the time went big with their form-a-balsa fuselage shell type full fuselage kits and curled steamed sheet wings for truer scale appearance. They were prettier but more for looks than stuntability, as they didn't have much of an elevator. Once finished, they looked competitive with the Cox and Wen-Mac RTF's. Back around 1968, I had their half-A Mitsubishi Zero.
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Post  rsv1cox Fri Apr 22, 2022 6:17 pm

The Piper is a Sterling Kit# S-36, Beginner's Super Cub (20.5" W/S)

Are you sure George? It's a profile, I don't recall Sterling building profile kits.  

I have never built a Midwest kit, and that P-40 is strange, the horizontal sits on top of the fuselage rather than mid-range.  Cold be a builder's error though.  

They are nasty, I'm having trouble finding proper wooden wheels for them 1 1/4".  There are some on ebay but the axle hole is too large, guess they will have to do and i will plug and redrill.

I thought they were made by the same manufacturer as the Bell cranks are identical.

A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader Dscn1827
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Post  GallopingGhostler Fri Apr 22, 2022 8:15 pm

rsv1cox wrote:The Piper is a Sterling Kit# S-36, Beginner's Super Cub (20.5" W/S)
Are you sure George? It's a profile, I don't recall Sterling building profile kits.
Absolutely. Sterling had a half-A series of beginner scale profile models since 1960's, wingspans nominally 21 inches, following is helps to provide a history.

1965 catalog showed the Beginners: S30 Ringmaster and S31 Mustang.

April 1970 Price List adds Beginners: S32 Ringmaster Bipe, list $2.95. S30 and S31 are $2.50 each.
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader 1970_s10

By 1973, catalog added Beginners: S34 Spitfire, S35 Thunderjet, S36 Super Cub, S37 Eindecker, S38 Shoestring, S39 Thunderbolt, and S40 Cherokee.
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader 1973c10

By 1989, catalog added Beginners: S41 Fokker D-VII, S42 Hellcat, S43 Focke-Wulf, S44 Zero, and S45 Messerschmitt
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader Sterli11
fNote, this page duplicates Page 15 in the 1989 Catalog but is Page 11 from another.

History has unfortunately evaporated on the Sterling Company and its product lines, as several websites that kept meticulous documentation have disappeared into the rabbit hole of time fairly recently. According to one video, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yPZRSBFjGTw , the Sterling Company was sold to Estes in 1988 except for their boat line. Shortly after, a mysterious fire burnt the factory to the ground, ending many of the products. However, my 1994 price list still shows the factory in existence not mentioning Estes of Penrose, CO, so perhaps the ownership transfer and fire occurred after that.

Here is my 1994 price list, Kits S30 to S45 Beginner Series in the right column all list for $11.95 each:
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader 1994_p10
Note, S33 Winder, an out of sequence 42.5" combat plane in 1973 catalog is discontinued.

Estes added several more kits to the Beginner series, renaming it to Quick Scale Series including Star Wars X-Wing and Y-Wing kits I have.

Here is a box of the S36 Cub found on the net (sold out):
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader 2022-030
Please note, by 1994, they renamed the kit from Super Cub to Piper Cub.

As you see, this is what you have.

rsv1cox wrote:I have never built a Midwest kit, and that P-40 is strange, the horizontal sits on top of the fuselage rather than mid-range.  Cold be a builder's error though.

Could be, or simply a non-scale simplification for easier building / die-cutting.

rsv1cox wrote:They are nasty, I'm having trouble finding proper wooden wheels for them 1 1/4".  There are some on ebay but the axle hole is too large, guess they will have to do and i will plug and redrill. I thought they were made by the same manufacturer as the Bell cranks are identical.

Or, the wheels and nylon parts were subcontracted out, the builder substituted parts from another kit, etc. They resemble the nylon parts used on my Top Flite half-A Mitsubishi Zero with full body, steamed molded balsa fuselage halves. However, Top Flite kit was nice as it came with rubber wheels with brass eyelet grommets.

rsv1cox wrote:A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader Dscn1827
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Post  rsv1cox Sat Apr 23, 2022 6:50 am

That's a pictorial education George.  Thanks.  

I have built some of those kits, a favorite is the Nieuport 17 which now hangs in my basement workshop.

A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader Dscn1828

I would spend time winding that rubber band and letting it go into tall grass.  

Bought those wooden wheels, only 1 1/4" that I could find, cheap enough on ebay for $1.76 a package, got two packages.  Will have to cement the axle in and re-drill.  Engines will get the Berrymans treatment, crock pot if they don't loosen, but they are as dirty as I have seen.  More fun projects more than anything else.

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Post  Dick Russ Tue Jun 21, 2022 4:08 pm

Would you be so kind as to weigh the models. I have been curious as to what the weight was of the COX plastic U-Control models
Thanking you in advance.
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Post  rsv1cox Tue Jun 21, 2022 6:27 pm

Dick Russ wrote:Would you be so kind as to weigh the models. I have been curious as to what the weight was of the COX plastic U-Control models
Thanking you in advance.
Dick

Happy to Dick.  I was curious to find out how the Wen Mac Corsair (in red no canopy) compared withthe Cox version anyway.  A mixture of Cox and Wen Macs.

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A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1013477
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A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1013478
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A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1013481
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1013482
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A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1013484
A decent PT-19, a buggy Cox F4U top loader and a new to me Cox F4U side loader P1013483
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