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Post  coxaddicted on Fri Jul 27, 2012 1:02 am

I am looking forward to buy a used black widow engine.

Can you tell me what a fair price is?
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Post  Cribbs74 on Fri Jul 27, 2012 1:34 am

$25-35 for an ok used one. $50 and upwards for a NIB one. A lot of variables can effect the asking price.
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Post  coxaddicted on Fri Jul 27, 2012 2:16 am

Thank you, that helps.

Are these engines within the strongest amongst the 0.49 class?
Or is it just a bee with an anodized crank case and extended fuel tank?
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Post  RknRusty on Fri Jul 27, 2012 5:33 am

It has the largest practical inlet and venturi. The pre-1996 cylinders (#1, before slit cylinders) had deeper bypass ports plus SPI. Later versions did not. Yes it's a good powerful version of the Bee, much more-so than the Golden Bee. Pre-'96 is superior, imho. Their high end performance is particularly sensitive to the quality of prop, size and balance. Up to $75 wouldn't be a ripoff for a NIB one. I a new pair for $64 on eBay last year.

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Post  coxaddicted on Fri Jul 27, 2012 5:50 am

That sounds pretty good. I will look for one.

I have already noticed, that later engines have a slit cylinders and that the black widow engine vary in the exhaust design (I own a normal product engine with slit cylinder, also the Kyosho-Cox-Conversion has a slitted exhaust port). Can anybody tell me the reason for this? Does a non slitted Cylinder reach more revs due to a bigger exhaust cross section?
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Post  coxaddicted on Sun Jul 29, 2012 12:35 pm

Just have buyed One for around 20 bucks. Will show pictures next week
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Post  RknRusty on Sun Jul 29, 2012 12:54 pm

coxaddicted wrote:That sounds pretty good. I will look for one.

I have already noticed, that later engines have a slit cylinders and that the black widow engine vary in the exhaust design (I own a normal product engine with slit cylinder, also the Kyosho-Cox-Conversion has a slitted exhaust port). Can anybody tell me the reason for this? Does a non slitted Cylinder reach more revs due to a bigger exhaust cross section?
When I can get a chance to write a detailed reply and point you to some threads about slit cylinders and the piston choices for them, I'll post an answer up for you.

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Post  coxaddicted on Thu Aug 02, 2012 10:17 am

Here is my first Black Widow (hope so?)
It has a # 1 Cylinder. There a some things that make me thoughtful:
The engine has no screen at the backplate, is this correct?
Furthermore it looks like, that the pre-owner has removed the last fin of the cylinder (I think to fit the cox tool)

Black Widow - adequate price? Dscf3410

The good thing is: the engine has compression and looks neat overall-
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Post  GermanBeez on Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:37 pm

servus chris,
i've seen a couple of engines that miss the screen on the back including one of my own bw's, i beleive some removed them to
increase air flow, so it wont harm your engine at all. The "cut out" fins were standard on later models, so the cox wrench wouldnt damage the exhaust ports if the cylinder
needed to be removed, so it's probably stock, unless the edges arent blackened.
you got yourself a very nice one, good job!
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Post  ahrma_581 on Thu Aug 02, 2012 2:04 pm

coxaddicted wrote:Can you tell me what a fair price is?

Looks like the new going rate is 10 bucks!!
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Post  coxaddicted on Fri Aug 03, 2012 4:38 am

GermanBeez wrote:servus chris,
i've seen a couple of engines that miss the screen on the back including one of my own bw's, i beleive some removed them to
increase air flow, so it wont harm your engine at all. The "cut out" fins were standard on later models, so the cox wrench wouldnt damage the exhaust ports if the cylinder
needed to be removed, so it's probably stock, unless the edges arent blackened.
you got yourself a very nice one, good job!
Beez

Thank you for this helpful comment, I will try to start it next week.

@ahrma 10 bucks would be very low, just in germany. I think the prices for cox engines are a little bit higher than in USA, due to availabillity.


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Post  RknRusty on Fri Aug 03, 2012 10:12 am

That's a beauty, even got a metal backplate, great. Be sure to remove the innards down to the crank and clean it and oil it before trying to crank it. Make sure the oil groove in the crank tube is clear of gunk. Blow brake parts cleaner through all of the back plate and NV orifices including the pickup nipple.

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Post  SuperDave on Fri Aug 03, 2012 10:36 am

I'd advise NOT to remove the venturi air screen as it's there for a purpose and any increased air flow would be very marginal.

Why do you imagine LeRoy Cox included an airscreen when he was attempting to cut production costs?
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Post  PV Pilot on Fri Aug 03, 2012 11:22 am

It;s a good bet that the needle orifice is green gooed up, a good cleaning like rusty posted before running should help.




Black Widow - adequate price? Microscopepics009-1A pic of green goo around the area where the needle valve assy plunges thru a plastic backplate, under my stereo microscope.
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Post  coxaddicted on Sun Aug 05, 2012 12:58 am

Wow! Many replies! Thank you!

Of course I will clean the engine before running. Concerning the screen: I have seen many Black Widows without screen, so I wonder if it was original for a short time of production. The Killer Bee runs also without screen, so I do not think that it is so important for engine life.

Next week I will receive another one Smile
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Post  RknRusty on Sun Aug 05, 2012 3:16 am

Some of the mouse racers take them out. I don't think Cox ever left them off, maybe Estes did out of laziness. I wouldn't worry too much about it. If you got fine grit in it it could possibly screw up the works, but mostly anything ingested gets stuck behind the reed with immediate and obvious performance results. Once it goes in the hole the reed is the only place it can go. Between runs, I give a quick blast of fresh fuel to rinse off behind the engine just to clear the castor goo whether there is a screen or not. One of my BWs is screenless.

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Post  coxaddicted on Sun Aug 05, 2012 11:05 am

Thank you!

In my car engine (Cox-Kyosho) the screen has also another function (-to prime the engine before starting).

So I will fit a screen. It was also a good advise to disassemble the engine before running. The showed engine was looking fine outside, but the pre-owner forgot the o-ring between fuel tank and backplate. I will clean it proper before starting.

I also bought another with extended fuel tank yesterday Very Happy

And today another one

I think I got enough black widows now Shh
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Post  RknRusty on Sun Aug 05, 2012 11:13 am

I have a few BWs, my favorite tanked reedie. I'd like them even better if they ran for longer than 1:30 - 1:45, but that's what I get for running them at full scream. That's also why I have zero use for Venoms and the other super high performance tanked types(except for my beloved RR1). I can't sprint to the control handle as fast as I used to.

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Post  PV Pilot on Sun Aug 05, 2012 11:39 am

RknRusty wrote: I can't sprint to the control handle as fast as I used to.


LOL!, well I definitely don't sprint anymore with my knees, it's more like a concentrated fast walk.

10' lines,,,lol.
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Post  coxaddicted on Fri Aug 31, 2012 7:59 pm

Here they are:
Black Widow - adequate price? Dscf3616
the other two ebay ones!
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Post  coxaddicted on Sat Sep 01, 2012 2:13 am

I know, the picture is not the best its just to complete the topic. These are #2 and 3. I was surprised that no One has a screen, But this is aleady solved -maybe german tuning ambitions of the 70/80ies Very Happy

Note the cox fuel extender of the right engine.
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