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paint and finish: Rustoleum Empty paint and finish: Rustoleum

Post  pkrankow on Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:12 pm

Started in another thread with Rusty, regarding restoring a Super Ringmaster (Kim started that thread, we both have the same plane) starting it here since it is general information.

I have used Rustoleum recently on some models and find it acceptably fuel proof. I have not however applied over dope.

I do like the sandable grey primer and find it fills the grain in wood well. It cuts very easily compared to the gloss enamel. It can also be sanded within a short time allowing several build up coats in a day.

I find gloss enamel has to sit at least 48 hours prior to sanding or masking for design or the paint is too soft.

Phil
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Post  Cribbs74 on Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:40 pm

Phil,

How well does it stay fuel proof over time. I assume you use Rustoleum as a finishing coat and no fuel proofing coat over it?

Reason I ask is because I have not had good success with it. I still use it as a base coat from time to time. I assume a long drying time is the key to sucess?

Much like Kim I use whatever gets me to the fun faster. Lustrekote costs roughly $2 more than a can of Rustoleum. It's bullet proof and.......it's ready to go in 24hrs. Plus I can use any base coat and apply Lustrekote over it and I'm done.

Am I missing something? A lot of guys use it successfully what's the secret?

Ron

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Post  mx862 on Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:55 pm

I would like to know also...

Im finishing up my guillows cessna 150 with the 010, and need to paint the cowl and wheel pants to match the red and white color scheme.

I cant get lusterkote locally and would have to wait 2 weeks+ if i order it. Ive been doing some reading on the rustoleum paints... but still not 100% sure what to get.
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Post  pkrankow on Thu Mar 21, 2013 12:00 am

2 week minimum cure time, and the paint may still discolor temporarily where raw fuel sits on it for a few minutes.

Yes that is 14 days.

Phil
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Post  RknRusty on Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:10 am

I only waited 7 days, I bet if I had waited 14, the paint wouldn't have crazed under the Lustrekote. I have trouble waiting on things like that.

Even when where I leave Rustoleum uncovered like on the tail and fuse and behind the wing, when I clean the plane with denatured alcohol I can see some of the color on the rag, but I have yet to go all the way through the Rustoleum or have it soften or let go of the wood. It loses it's shine a little bit but it's only noticeable in the shop lights and still looks great in the sunlight. If I leave oil on it for a week before a thorough cleaning, it's no worse. I don't really get fuel on the paint, just exhaust oil and it doesn't bother it at all. But I wouldn't want unsealed Rustoleum up front. I make sure everything at least as far back as the wing roots has Lustrekote over it.

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Post  pkrankow on Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:54 am

On the yellow plane I broke the tail off with a bulkhead mount Cox .049 the paint behind the venturi was wet with fuel when I removed the motor. It had sat that way for about an hour. The color was much lighter, but paint did not seem to transfer when I wiped it dry. By the time I rebuilt the tail (a couple days) the color was the same as elsewhere.

Apparently I did not get all the oil off since some places wrinkled when I repainted.

Phil
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Post  pkrankow on Fri Mar 22, 2013 5:46 pm

I had a positive test with some Rustoleum "Painter's Touch" today. This was an extremely well cured sample that was applied about 6 months ago. I applied 15% nitromethane fuel onto a folded paper towel and let it sit for about an hour. The color lightened slightly (light blue to slightly lighter blue) but nothing transferred to the paper towel upon rubbing.

This is nice because there are so many colors to choose from. I will try a sample with a less lengthy cure time in the near future.

Phil
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Post  RknRusty on Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:04 pm

Something else you may want to test; I've read the lighter colors are more fuel proof than the darker ones. I've never seen a problem on my planes with black or dark blue on them, but it's worth a try.

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Post  pkrankow on Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:07 pm

RknRusty wrote:Something else you may want to test; I've read the lighter colors are more fuel proof than the darker ones. I've never seen a problem on my planes with black or dark blue on them, but it's worth a try.

I suspect this is because transfer is more apparent than with lighter colors than a change in fuel-proof-ness. I am sure the pigment load changes with different colors.

My test board, in this case, is actually a Sig Skyray I intended an electric conversion, but could not resolve the tail heavy nature of the airframe. It is getting a Cox reed engine in the near future.

I will be painting my lil' com-bats soon, with the plan of a red/white/blue color scheme on one. I haven't decided the colors on the other.

Phil
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Post  RknRusty on Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:32 pm

pkrankow wrote:...I will be painting my lil' com-bats soon, with the plan of a red/white/blue color scheme on one. I haven't decided the colors on the other.

Phil
Have you seen my Red, White, and Blue Lil Bats?

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paint and finish: Rustoleum Sam_1512

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Post  pkrankow on Sat Mar 23, 2013 8:44 am

That has to be insane with a TD on it!

I have seen that picture before, and will be avoiding that exact scheme. I am thinking the angular scheme similar to my red and yellow Super Ringmaster.

Phil
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Post  pkrankow on Sun Apr 21, 2013 9:06 pm

Follow up on Rustoleum Painter's Touch.

Fuel proof except where fuel is held pooled for extended periods such as the engine mount area of a Bee. I had to remove the bee from my Sig Skyray and the engine was glued in place.

25% nitromethane did not affect the paint for spills. Exhaust is fine, the only problem I had is where the fuel tank back gets wet with fuel and the fuel is held in place, unable to be wiped up or allowed to evaporate.

I recommend a fuel proof clear coat in key areas if using Rustoleum Painter's Touch, but my sample of 1 (light blue) is fine for all wipeable areas without additional treatment.

This means over 50 new colors may be available!

I will be testing purple in the near future.

Phil
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Post  GUS THE I.A. on Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:01 am

I caught that... Testing purple... I hope it works!
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Post  pkrankow on Thu Apr 25, 2013 11:34 pm

Purple and gold. My high school colors.
Both are the Rustoleum painter's touch. Base coat is white rustoleum enamel
Phil
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Post  pkrankow on Thu May 02, 2013 10:01 pm

Just updating to keep time. I painted on April 26. I am fuel proofing the engine mount on the purple and gold bat with 2 heavy coats of Testor's cement, since the mount was the only place I had troubles, first coat tonight. I plan to let it sit a week more before powering it and hopefully flying soon after.

I have a Baby Stunt Bee that is going on this plane. I hope it balances well.

Phil

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Post  RK Flyer on Thu Aug 22, 2013 4:00 pm

WoW! I am sooo glad I've found this forum!!  

I just got home from my local hobby Shops (2) looking for Fuel Proof Paint and of course the selection was very small, like nothing in stock, so I started talking with the sales lady and she called another shop so the answer was to use Rustoleum with a clear coat of Fuel proof over it.
Nothing was said about the curing time.

Do anyone have an up date on the Rustoleum Paint?

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Post  JPvelo on Thu Aug 22, 2013 4:45 pm

I have had very good succes with Rustoleum non metallic colors. I find that it holds up well even at the front of the plane where it gets exposed to raw fuel and exhaust. My trick for quick curing is to bake the painted fuselage in my truck. I live in Phoenix and the interior of a car parked in the sun gets into the 200 degre range. I hang parts in my truck while it sits in the parking lot for eight hours at work. So far no one has asked why there are wee airplanes hanging in my ride. I have painted one day and flown the next and been just fine.

As far as applying over dope my last three planes had the wood sealed with dope and Rustoleum applied 24 hours later. So far all is well.

The one plane I painted with Rustoleum metallic turned into a sticky mess. I have tested clear, it did not do well. I also did not "bake" it or let it cure long enough. Funny, I was just thinking of shooting a patch of clear on my twin and letting cure for two weeks and then fly it. I will report the results here. Hopefully they will be positive, I would like the option of using a metallic color sealed with clear. Pkrankow, how did the gold turn out on your Kombat?

Jim
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Post  pkrankow on Thu Aug 22, 2013 5:40 pm

Thanks for the reminder the gloss yellow (not metallic gold, sorry) "Painter's Touch" lightened more that the "Stop Rust" gloss yellow behind the engine where fuel puddles and collects.  The rest of the airplane was no problem at all.  After a day or so the color returned to normal.

"Painter's Touch" colors in general seem to lighten with fuel contact quite quickly and noticeably, but the effect is temporary on the colors I have tried.

So I have tried successfully

"Stop Rust"
white
brown
yellow
blue
red

"painter's touch" gloss
yellow
purple
light blue
white

"sandable primer"
grey
(there is a white that is reported suitable too)

I might have tried a couple other colors.  I haven't had a failure with regular gloss colors.  I have a can of black sitting here, and I think I have green too.

My test is to paint a surface, allow a minimum 14 day cure time, fold a paper towel into a small square and saturate with Sig Champion 25% nitromethane.  The folded paper towel should hold enough fuel to stay wet for an hour.  Covering with plastic is a good idea.  

A "pass" does not have color on the paper towel when the towel is lifted.  Light scrubbing with the paper towel should not transfer color either, but slight color transfer is still acceptable.  

Slight "gummy feel" when scrubbing is allowed, but actual gumminess (paper towel sticking to the surface), peeling, sloughing, or wearing through in a few seconds is not.

Discoloration of the test patch is of no concern as long as it returns to original color overnight.

This is rattle can paint, so don't expect top marks for finish in a contest.

Best results are obtained by sanding almost all the paint off several times to fill the grain of the wood, then applying color coats.  Excess paint is excess weight (something I struggle with) so sanding down the first color coat till the primer barely starts showing then applying a finish coat is probably a good idea.  

Rustoleum does not sand well till more than 48 hours old.  It is still debatable about how well it sands then, but it normally doesn't ball up into a gummy mess for me after that long of a cure.  It is notably harder after 2 weeks when sanding. The exception is the "Sandable primer" which cuts easily after the short indicated dry time (read the instructions, I don't have a can in front of me).

Phil
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Post  RK Flyer on Thu Aug 22, 2013 6:07 pm

Thanks for the update!!

Jim, it dosent get that hot here in Portland, Oregon but I'll try to think of something.......
well the wife is working sooo if I get into her Kitchen and the Oven....... Temp at 200.....Timer at 8 hrs....should work.......Right???? Shocked 

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There I am.
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Post  JPvelo on Thu Aug 22, 2013 6:19 pm

RK Flyer wrote:Thanks for the update!!

Jim, it dosent get that hot here in Portland, Oregon but I'll try to think of something.......
well the wife is working sooo if I get into her Kitchen and the Oven....... Temp at 200.....Timer at 8 hrs....should work.......Right???? Shocked 

RK FLYER
There I am.
You'll just go ahead and wait the 14 days if you know what's good for you. I need to move to Portland and cool off! It's actually on my list of places to move in four years when my son is out of high school. The fact that there seems to be a strong control line community definitely helps!

Jim
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Post  JPvelo on Thu Aug 22, 2013 6:32 pm

pkrankow wrote:Best results are obtained by sanding almost all the paint off several times to fill the grain of the wood, then applying color coats.  Excess paint is excess weight (something I struggle with) so sanding down the first color coat till the primer barely starts showing then applying a finish coat is probably a good idea.
Last two models I've done got two coats full strength dope, followed by tissue/lite silkspan applied with full strength. I then applied several coats of dope thinned 50/50 mixed with talc. Sanded with 300 between coats, finished with 600 and applied one wet rustoleum coat. Results are good and added less than 1/4oz to my Yaking Clown.

Jim
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Post  pkrankow on Thu Aug 22, 2013 6:42 pm

JPvelo wrote:
pkrankow wrote:Best results are obtained by sanding almost all the paint off several times to fill the grain of the wood, then applying color coats.  Excess paint is excess weight (something I struggle with) so sanding down the first color coat till the primer barely starts showing then applying a finish coat is probably a good idea.
Last two models I've done got two coats full strength dope, followed by tissue/lite silkspan applied with full strength. I then applied several coats of dope thinned 50/50 mixed with talc. Sanded with 300 between coats, finished with 600 and applied one wet rustoleum coat. Results are good and added less than 1/4oz to my Yaking Clown.

Jim
I can get clear dope "locally" (hour drive) so I might have to try this with my baby flight streak build.

BTW, real talc or baby powder (typically cornstarch)

Phil
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Post  JPvelo on Thu Aug 22, 2013 6:53 pm

pkrankow wrote:
JPvelo wrote:
pkrankow wrote:Best results are obtained by sanding almost all the paint off several times to fill the grain of the wood, then applying color coats.  Excess paint is excess weight (something I struggle with) so sanding down the first color coat till the primer barely starts showing then applying a finish coat is probably a good idea.
Last two models I've done got two coats full strength dope, followed by tissue/lite silkspan applied with full strength. I then applied several coats of dope thinned 50/50 mixed with talc. Sanded with 300 between coats, finished with 600 and applied one wet rustoleum coat. Results are good and added less than 1/4oz to my Yaking Clown.

Jim
I can get clear dope "locally" (hour drive) so I might have to try this with my baby flight streak build.

BTW, real talc or baby powder (typically cornstarch)

Phil
Baby powder, so I guess corn starch. When you mix it add the starch to the thiner, shake to mix, then add the dope. Much less clumpimg this way. I thinned about 50/50, next time I'll go 60 thinner/40 dope to reduce "roping" (brush marks).

Jim
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Post  GUS THE I.A. on Sat Aug 24, 2013 2:49 am

I have used Krylon, for the purple on my planes, with great results! The Ringmaster was finished in SIG Koverall and white dope, then sprayed Krylon on it for the stripes and stuff. Then, like an idiot, I decided to shoot clear Rustoleum over the whole thing. Dummy! I had Go-Itis, and flew it before the clear had cured, and the entire plane became sticky. Later, I heard that one of the only Rustoleum products that is not even marginally fuel-proof, is the clear! So, I've been slowly wearing off the sticky with exhaust from the engine-almost done! It can be launched now, without sticking to their fingers, so much. I have used the purple Krylon spray paint on lots of different coverings-and I don't even scuff the surface, to help with adhesion. Works for me!
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