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Cox Engine of The Month
November-2017
MauricioB's

"Cox Tee Dee .010"



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Tee Dee Performance Crank

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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  balogh on Fri Oct 31, 2014 7:52 am

BTW I have this setup in my Tucan RC plane powered by an antic 051 with tapered bore/piston equipped throttle exhaust barrel...this critter is past 100 hours runtime and turns Bernies 5x4 black prop at 22k on the ground, a bit higher when mid-air.

I have slightly widened the openings on the standard throttle barrel to make sure the full throttle run has unobstructed exhaust flow.

Here is my vid (one of them) on youtube, if you are interested.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aTZ8WcmHdpE
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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  balogh on Fri Oct 31, 2014 8:03 am

Hey, 1/2A Nut, I found this on rcgroups: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2241141

Was it your post? Could you advise where I could get the design drawings of the speedplane? I'd love to build one for my TD 051-s
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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  1/2A Nut on Fri Oct 31, 2014 2:47 pm

Yes that is my thread its a 5 channel with flaps.

Your vid 21.6k to 22.3krpm most times level and 23.9k in best dive
Moment of throttle control 14k rpm

Im just on for a min will respond better after work RC Plane

Whatch out for this guy on ebay he will make up a batch for each TD size

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Cox-15-Tee-Dee-Aluminum-Carb-Body-with-Oring-Seals-Black-Anodize-/251657820244?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2047675.l2557&nma=true&si=2K82u2HHkAZiRpt8jGmE4Sgvx8k%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc#ht_1205wt_1105



http://www.ebay.com/itm/251657820244?_trksid=p2060778.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT#ht_1205wt_1171

Shipping:$1.92 Standard Shipping | See details  
Item location:Blossvale, New York, United States
Seller:ridenfligh (1146 )
sold over 1,146 units online thus far he is out of stock at the moment so just have to save his web page and check from time to time.
Based in United States, ridenfligh has been an eBay member since Dec 03, 2000

http://www.ebay.com/usr/ridenfligh?_trksid=p2047675.l2559


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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  balogh on Fri Oct 31, 2014 6:49 pm

Thx that is very useful...but how about the 1/2A speedplane plans,are these publicly available somewhere?
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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  dckrsn on Fri Oct 31, 2014 6:57 pm

Regarding e-bay seller ridenfligh, he's a straight-up guy in my book.
I contacted him about an .049 TeeDee carb body in bare aluminum(which
wasn't listed) and he served one right up, no problem.
Bob
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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  1/2A Nut on Fri Oct 31, 2014 8:56 pm

The Skorch is my own design the build thread was progressive without the need to draw plans up rather templates. The first was for TD .010 to TD .020 the second TD .049 to TD .09 the 3rd one is coming up TD .09 to TD .15


Two build threads:

Stage 1
Lil Speedy  - TD .010 to TD .020
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/1-2-1-8-airplanes-70/11597545-cox-td-010-ply-rolled-fuselage-3ch-speeder.html

Stage 2
Skorch - TD .049 to TD .09
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/1-2-1-8-airplanes-70/11602404-ply-rolled-fuselage-part-deux-1-2a-mini-skorch.html

Stage 3  
TD .09 to TD .15
My Original Designs:  Legacy / Texas Wind /  Kyle Lee Bradley
(Legacy was built in 1989 / 84in span) may do one for this class.



Could lean out the designs for more speed:


Last edited by 1/2A Nut on Sat Nov 01, 2014 4:31 am; edited 1 time in total
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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  balogh on Fri Oct 31, 2014 8:59 pm

Thanks alot, I will look them up. Just a quick one: is the wing for the 049 size full balsa, or balsa-sheeted skeleton of formers and spars?
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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  1/2A Nut on Sat Nov 01, 2014 1:14 am

I like to use solid balsa planks and sculpt out and airfoil this one has a near fully symmetrical wing from thick
10mm balsa when measured with a caliper.

Stated as 3/8x4x36"  on the lable plank weight from store 2.74oz

4 x 30in tapered swept tip wing came out at 88 SQ IN.
Weight after sanding 37g or 1.3oz





About 9.5mm thick and 1 mm thick trailing  edge.

Completed less servo's for ailerons and flaps - thin 1/64th ply sheet center top and bottom protects the balsa, adds strength and for when cutouts mounting 2 servos.



Underside shows the setup for what will be simple wedge type monokote hinged surfaces.

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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  1/2A Nut on Sat Nov 01, 2014 2:03 am

Agreed Bob, regarding e-bay seller ridenfligh.

I have had a few discussions with Mike about future project offerings. I have bought multiple units of everything he sells.
Backplates for 6 of my TD .020's, many many carb bodies for .010,.020,.049,.09,.15's, APC prop adapter inserts for .049's.  

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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  Ken Cook on Sat Nov 01, 2014 6:18 am

Mike is a great guy. I designed those APC adapters and Mike started producing them. I also designed or I should say redesigned Cyclon/Profi mounts which he's made a lot of. His work is top notch and he appreciates all the support. Ken
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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  1/2A Nut on Sun Nov 02, 2014 4:16 pm

Ok took the engine apart after 4 runs of 3ish mins each everything looked good no black goo build up.
I had the ball socket reset and fired up for med throttle for a warm up then let her rip with the tarnado thin wood 6x2 and throttle sleeve it hit 22,180 rpm steady two shims with a new old stock vintage high compression head, fresh fuel 30% nitro 25% castor ambient temp 76 degrees.

I kept the stock NV leaned it out then backed off a hair. No pressure just suction. No apparent vibration or oscillation when viewing the wood prop from the side. Prop was new old stock. Could have balance the prop to eek out some more rpm but no big deal this engine has now been oiled and bagged ready for use with a APC 4.2 x 4 and should do about 23.5+ static with a Kirn Kraft NV will just settle for that and not mod any further in lieu of the bored out pin. Thrust was impressive with the the thin wood 6 x 2 prop!





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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  fredvon4 on Wed Nov 05, 2014 9:15 am

Finally got a few runs on three of the four project Tee Dees. No way with my el cheapo tach to reliably say if the so called Hi Performance crank means anything but a viable option as a replacement shaft. Also I did not detect any significant increase using the JB weld crank shaft interior "ramp" to direct fuel flow to the rear better. The truth is I did not deliberately peak each engine to max scream and ran each of them at what is usually my semi wet needle setting like I would fly them

Generally each one is happy around 24,700 RPM with the smaller Blue prop, 22,500 with the cut down rubber ducky, and 23,250 RPM with the Green prop. I used Venturies from .110 up to .145 and did not get any real difference in RPM.

Weather here turned windy, cold and wet so flying each will have to wait

The 5-40 Tap came in (glad I bought 2 of them) and I screwed up and cost myself $35 by trying to twist a bit to hard against the burr (perhaps the original threads were simply not cut correctly)
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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  balogh on Wed Nov 05, 2014 12:04 pm

Too bad with the broken shaft end!!!

Your speeds seem quite high. What are the prop sizes for each of the above speeds? And the fuel blend?

My crazy-runner 051 (old stock, tapered bore, without mods, but 100+ hours runtime on it) swings the 5x4 prop of COX Int'l at 22k, with nitro/castor max 20%/20% in the fuel.
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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  fredvon4 on Wed Nov 05, 2014 12:45 pm

Fuel used was Sig 25%N 20% oil (a 50 /50 mix they blend with synth and castor)

I have flown the light weight (designed for Heavier and much faster Cyclon or Fora 1/2As) combat planes with these Tee Dees and cut down rubber duckie (durable in a figure 9)

But to your question: the Tee Dee .049s seem happy on the bench with Yellow Bernie sourced 5D 3P cut down to 4.75"D and rounded tips

The so called glass props come to me from
http://aerohobby.ca/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=3&products_id=178

By eyeball they look to be around 3 to 3.5"Pitch. The Blue ones are 4 3/4" and the Green are 4 15/16". Not tested yet are the APC 5.5"D 2P and 2.5P that scream up to 32K RPM (where my tach tops out) on the Fora .049s

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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  balogh on Wed Nov 05, 2014 12:52 pm

Thanks, Fred. Are these small dia props not posing the danger of engine failure at extremely high revs? COX's TD049-051 manuals state speeds in excess of 22,5k or so shouold be avoided.
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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  balogh on Wed Nov 05, 2014 12:56 pm

Sorry, I checked again, the recommended top speed is 24k


http://coxengines.ca/files/049%20Tee%20Dee.pdf
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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  fredvon4 on Wed Nov 05, 2014 1:20 pm

Because of the 24K max RPM and others who note TDs grenade around 26K should you twist them that high. I think I won't use the blue props much unless they give some serious advantage in the air where I am sure they might go over 25k.

My Aero Norvel .049 engines get over 30K RPM and love the blue props. Unfortunately that combination hauls my planes too fast for me right now
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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  1/2A Nut on Fri Nov 07, 2014 2:58 pm

Thank you Fred for the numbers and findings, I would imagine keeping the TD's under 24k is key to having a useable seasonal engine.

I obtained a new old stock Hobby Lobby sold as Meredith off ebay and drew up something suitable 1/9th scale will need to use a TD .09 looks like the TD .051 shown next to the 22g pilot figure is tad small. I think having a certain scale pilot dictates the types of aircraft design that ends up on the drawing board.





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Last edited by 1/2A Nut on Fri Nov 07, 2014 10:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  getback on Fri Nov 07, 2014 4:35 pm

yes if the pilot is larger than the engine there would be a problem unless he has big arms lol! Eric Pumpkin Leaves Stupid Leaves
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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  1/2A Nut on Sat Nov 08, 2014 3:37 am

Leaves Lol Eric,

Yea if with a 1/2A engine the pilot would have to fly an ultralight or small experimental design. The piston is in range
to the scale hand of the pilot.  I could go with a lightweight all balsa eggshell or stringer constructed fuselage and boney built up wing. I blew up the design on my 32in monitor, would be doable just pushing the engine a bit... all up RTF could be sub 18oz.

Then again TD .09's collect dust waiting for a day in the sun even ye ol Queen Buzz.   Sad




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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  balogh on Sat Nov 08, 2014 4:34 am

1/2A Nut, thanks for the threads and photos, here is ma Skorch in the making. Baseball is not so common in Hungary so I use a snooker pole to wrap the fuselage round.




I estimated/snitched the fuselage dimensions from your photos so I am not sure if this one will be a candidate for a 100+ mph speed but I will make sure my TD051 will pull it way faster than any of my R/C planes before.

How long did you let the fuse dry before you removed it from the baseball bat? Will a hairdryer accelerate the forming process or I should rather let it dry naturally, allowing more time for the plywood to cure in the final shape?

I will probably use my favorire fuel tank arrangement i.e a balloon tank as it will fill the space in the compartment behind the firewall more effficiently than the plastic tank that also needs a heavy clunk, vent pipe etc. And the balloon allows for a more rigid fuse former just in front of the wing even with the tank remaining removeable ; I have to cut only a small opening in the former (a bit larger than the diameter of the rubber stopper in the throat of the tank) to make the tank removeable through it, while the former would leave the plastic tank built in forever, unless a bottom hatch is provided

I am not planning on a hatch for the tank as this never seals well and would allow the castor dripping from the engine sneak in and make the fuse internals a mess. I will, instead, glue in a permanent sheeting under the tank that will also make the fuse front more rigid just in case unplanned landings nose down occur. (Ya never know with a plane that is built not on proven designs but on snitched/estimated dimensions)

I am wondering if  ailerons are a must? I have several R/C planes with low wing design that fly, turn, and do aerobatics well even without ailerons. No dehydral either.

Will post a few more pictures as the project moves ahead.
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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  1/2A Nut on Sat Nov 08, 2014 10:29 am

Perceptions help mold your efforts into your own design one you can embrace and favor.
Here is a photo to help answer your concerns on the fuselage.



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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  1/2A Nut on Sat Nov 08, 2014 10:46 am

My tank is removable here is a pic. 2 ply formers sandwiches in landing gear wire -former is 7mm thick with a stop block of sq. stock spruce for additional strength also gives me a spot to park a screw. Tank is closer to the cg to reduce any balance shifting throughout the run. I'm on crank case pressure the balloon trick should serve you well. You can epoxy or superglue in short pieces of metal tube into the firewall to avoid oil seeping into the fuel bay if with a hard tank. For a pressure lines for balloon tank you have to get more inventive. I left my lil speedy open under the tank but the drag does add up so for the Skorch I wanted to use a hatch also the battery is in with the tank so its a done deal.



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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  1/2A Nut on Sat Nov 08, 2014 10:54 am

Note I used carbon tube to support the back side of the landing gear former and double up for the wing rubber band hold downs piano wire in the back to avoid not having rubbing and space issues for the push rods that will be sliding / moving in this area.


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Mad Re: Tee Dee Performance Crank

Post  1/2A Nut on Sat Nov 08, 2014 11:12 am

Looks like you should be ready to install the front firewall then rear wing saddle former then  wing saddle strips. Your airfoil pattern is simplified, are you planning on a sheet wing or built up? You have total control over design aspects so a rudder controlled low wing plane is possible if you don't mind the losses. I wanted full acro and stunt flaps also to help slow it down when put putting about up close and for landings since the wing only has 88sq inches.


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