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Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

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Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  Tinker Terry on Fri Oct 24, 2014 4:51 am

Anyone know where I can find plans for the BRM that had the big leading edge beam with the slots for the ribs? I know a lot of you guys don't like that version but the big leading edge made a great wing, was strong and durable and eliminated the "rib ripper center spar. RC Plane
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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  Cribbs74 on Fri Oct 24, 2014 5:00 am

Terry,

Not sure what version you are talking about. The Sterling version had a 2 piece solid formed leading edge with rib notches. They still used a center spar, but it can be ommited if you desire.

You can get free BRM plans from outerzone.

http://www.outerzone.co.uk/plan_files_05/5652/Baby_Ringmaster_22in.pdf

Looking closely at the plans it appears to be a shrunken Jr. Ringmaster.

Not bad thing in my opinion, but not an original BRM.



Ron
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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  Tinker Terry on Sat Oct 25, 2014 9:33 am

Thanks Cribbs for the info, forgot about outerzone having free plans. The one I built back in the 70s had the one piece solid leading edge. Have never seen plans for one with a two piece leading edge that I can recall, but I do recall having a plane I built in the late 60s that was nearly identical to my last BRM except that it did have a two piece leading edge that was swept back slightly. It soon got too heavy to fly due to the multiple repairs as the join at the center of the wing kept breaking. Was a bit too much for a beginner and my landings tended towards the vertical. Flew too fast even with an 020 cox engine on it and with the big prop I had on it it was kinda slow taking off but once it got going it went!
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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  pkrankow on Sat Oct 25, 2014 3:32 pm

That set of plans on Outerzone is a redrawn set to the same outlines with different internals. The original had the rib ripper, which could be omitted, and I don't know where to get a set of the original plans for scratch building. The plans as kitted were assembly instructions and not for scratch build.

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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  Cribbs74 on Sat Oct 25, 2014 3:45 pm

Terry,

Are you perhaps thinking of the lil Jumpin bean?

I've been looking and the only kit I can think of with a slightly swept back wing is the Jumpin Bean



Phil,

Are you able to see more than one plan on outerzone?

The only one I can find is the one I posted above. That one is surely a Jr. Ring stab and elevator and fuse.

I seem to remember another plan on there that was closer to the original, but even that one had differences.
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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  getback on Sat Oct 25, 2014 6:42 pm

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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  getback on Sat Oct 25, 2014 7:27 pm

here is a link to mine that I have yet to finish got side tracked with a warp and I think the old monakote was the problem https://www.coxengineforum.com/t6072-almost-there-with-the-b-ring?highlight=baby+ring
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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  Cribbs74 on Sat Oct 25, 2014 7:29 pm

That's the one I was thinking of Eric.

Everything is spot on to the Sterling apart from the fuselage.
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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  pkrankow on Sun Oct 26, 2014 2:30 am

The plan on hip pocket is almost the kitted original. I believe the original kitted baby ringmaster had a shaped LE and not a square stick. I know the BRM I have is an original, but the wings are covered opaque.

Phil
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re: wanted BRM plans

Post  happydad on Sun Oct 26, 2014 3:40 am

Here is what I have on the Sterling Baby Ringmaster. I also have made templates of each of the parts except the leading and trailing edges since they looked like standard shaped stock.

here are the Sterling plans


here are most of the templates


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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  Cribbs74 on Sun Oct 26, 2014 4:03 am

Yep,

That's the one.
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Engine mounts

Post  Tinker Terry on Sun Oct 26, 2014 9:15 am

The last BRM I built had a plastic engine mount that you bolted the engine to and then attached it to the plane with rubber bands. I can't remember how the landing gear was attached thoughi know some versions had the gear attached near the leading edge of the wing and I think it also involved rubber bands. Did Carl Goldberg make a version of the BRM? Any possibility you might be able to send me a copy of those plans you have?
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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  Ken Cook on Sun Oct 26, 2014 1:49 pm

Sterling kits did not use rubber bands on the firewall. You might be confusing this with the Carl Goldberg Jumping Bean which utilized rubber bands for it's flexible bungee gear. Goldberg also provided a plastic rubber banded mounted firewall for the Lil Wizard. Sterling used a nylon mount and prior to that they used aluminum angles. In both situations, nylon or  aluminum the gear was sandwiched between the back of the engine backplate  and front of the mount in which an inverted V was molded or stamped into the mount in order to recess the gear wire. Ken
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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  Tinker Terry on Sun Oct 26, 2014 4:17 pm

I do recall my first plane having a the aluminum angle mounts. At any rate what I wanted mostly is the plan for the wing and it seems to be a pretty popular airfoil as nearly every built up being I've looked in PLCs or plans looks pretty much like it.
I actually plan to build an rc version with a 4 Oz tank and 6 ch Spektrum Rx and cox icon servos. Was just looking at the manual for the rx and it seems to have a misprint. Says it weighs 26oz which it might if the whole package was gift wrapped in lead foil or something like that. I don't have scales to weight it though. It's the 6210 dsmx and has 2 recievers. Be nice if it could be connected so as to use all 6 channels but i don't think that's possible as it has only 6 connections plus the bind/data port and the battery has to connect to one port. Oh well my tx is only 4 c anyways so 4 c will be all i have anyway.
Does anyone make receivers desighned for IC engines anymore? All i have seen are made to connect the battery through the ESC for electric motors.
Thanks all for your input it's been a great help.
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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  pkrankow on Sun Oct 26, 2014 5:43 pm

They make BEC devices to eliminate the ECS. The rechargeable battery backs and alkaline battery packs are still available. Review your manual, I believe the bind/data port can be used for a battery.

A Y connection can also be used for battery power in certain (not all) cases. Be 100% sure of your voltages!

The Baby ring master is a poor choice for an RC conversion. It is too small. It also lacks flap/aileron provisions, required since te wing is flat without dihedral.

I recommend you root around http://outerzone.co.uk/ for a design that might be suitable to your power choice, or select a design and buy a suitable engine. If you still need wing shapes then look up an airfoil plot tool such as http://airfoiltools.com/ and have fun.

This is the mount you wanted.
https://www.coxengineforum.com/t3375-scans-of-my-lil-wizard-rubber-band-engine-mount?highlight=wizard
It is a breakaway type device.

Phil
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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  Tinker Terry on Sun Oct 26, 2014 7:08 pm

Phil I checked the manual and it doesn't say you can't connect to the B/D port but if the bat is then how would you insert the bind plug? I does say insert bind plug and connect battery to any open port when not using an esc. It does say the throttle port is ESC/BEC. I presume that you can't connect a servo and that battery to the same port and have the servo function properly. What is a BEC?
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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  pkrankow on Mon Oct 27, 2014 2:12 am

When you bind have only 1 servo and put the battery into any other servo position.  After you are confident on the bench you have bound, then install into the airframe with all servos.

BEC battery elimination circuit. A misnamed or at least poorly named device (there has to be a battery) that steps power from a large lipo to the correct voltage.

Phil
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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  Tinker Terry on Tue Oct 28, 2014 6:55 pm

OK the mount I have is the nylon one from sterling.
The info on binding seems to be spot on aslo. I would guess that to bind after the Rx is installed I would have to disconnect one servo, connect battery to the servo port, insert bind plug,power up the Rx and follow binding instructions for the tx, then switch the connections on the Rx reconnecting servo, and test all functions.
Have been studying plans from hip pocket aeronautics and have gotten some good ideas on how to build my prototype. A lot of the sterling kits were designed for free flight/control lines/RC. Pretty much all the 1/2A and planes that were designed for the 049 hand wingspans around 30_36 inches. There is a rm junior version with 30 inch wingspan and full body for rc so I think I can design something that will work.
It appears I am not the first to think of putting the aileron servos on a sliding tray, which is moved by the elevator servo to give me flaperons. Soon as I get some $$$ for the servos and they arrive I will start a build thread.
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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  pkrankow on Tue Oct 28, 2014 8:31 pm

You are not using a computer radio?  Flap-elevator, flap-aileron, and flaps are easy.  WAY easier than mechanical, and fully trimable unlike mechanical , but require independent servos.  The extra 9g servo is nothing compared to a sliding tray weight wise too.

Build a simple design unless you have years of flight experience.  You will break it.

Phil
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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  Waffleman on Tue Oct 28, 2014 9:34 pm

pkrankow wrote:You are not using a computer radio?  Flap-elevator, flap-aileron, and flaps are easy.  WAY easier than mechanical, and fully trimable unlike mechanical , but require independent servos.  The extra 9g servo is nothing compared to a sliding tray weight wise too.

Build a simple design unless you have years of flight experience.  You will break it.

Phil

I second this.

Mechanically speaking, it is easier to make a two-servo aileron setup than a single servo setup. The programming side is not too hard on modern computer radio. Adding flaperons to a two-servo aileron system using a computer radio is nothing but a matter of programming the transmitter. Doing the same with a single-servo aileron setup non-computer radio is difficult mechanically, and likely to be fragile and heavy at such a small scale.
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Re: Baby Ringmaster plans wanted.

Post  Tinker Terry on Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:42 pm

Well when I have the money I will be upgrading to a new tx, if my lottery ticket is a winner that will be real soon but till then I'll be using the 4c that came with my hobbyzone champ. Being mechanically inclined I have also figured out how to build in some aileron differential mechanically. Works much like the way auto steering is designed to turn the inside wheel a few degrees more than the outside wheel. And the sharper the turn the more difference in turning angle.
So servos=throttle+ailerons+rudder+elevator=4 servos. Thats what I'll be starting out with. I will build a sliding tray to fit a cox icon servo and weigh it just to see how it comprares to a servo weight wise.
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