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Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

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Thinking Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  GallopingGhostler Mon Feb 02, 2015 5:42 pm

I purchased a remote NVA for an Evolution 46 engine from Amazon:

http://www.amazon.com/Remote-NV-Assm-Complete-TPS/dp/B0006O5II4/

from source, Horizon Hobbies:

http://www.horizonhobby.com/remote-nv-assm-%28complete%29%3Atps-40-46-evo046874a

Interestingly enough, its mount matches the backplate bolts on my Testors McCoy 35 Red Head. This opens up possibilities. When I get a chance to bench it will know more.

Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head Mccoy310
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  roddie Mon Feb 02, 2015 6:26 pm

George, there's a gal ("Chellie") who has gasket-kits for your McCoy .35 Red-Head and others. I learned of her through Ken Cook. I think she has an eBay store.. but you can reach her if you have a YouTube account. I have a .35 Red-Head and my dad recently gave me a .19 red-head that needs some TLC. I'll probably be contacting her for some gasket kits.. at least.

https://www.youtube.com/user/CHELLIE2408/discussion

Dad's McCoy .19 (needs a needle)

Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head My_dad10
Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head My_dad11


(needs more than a needle..) ewwww............

Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head My_dad13
Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head My_dad14

I wonder if it can be restored..? This has me concerned... Is this back-plate 90 degrees clockwise out-of-position? I don't know much about these engines.. and haven't had this one apart (it was given to me with the head off.. and missing most of the head-screws.)

Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head 9-28-110
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  GallopingGhostler Mon Feb 02, 2015 7:01 pm

Roddie, of course it can be restored, provided it still has compression. Screws I believe are common 4-40. A good set of ANSI wire crimp tool comes with a threaded bolt cutter, so one can trim to suit. 4-40 screws are available at most hardware stores. Some go through the extra trouble to find and use socket head screws, which of course are superior.

Yes, the back is mounted incorrectly on the 19RH. It should read up when cylinder is upright, not to the side. That chamber in the back just to the left of "UP" forms a part of the bypass transfer port for the air/fuel mixture.

Regarding cleaning up that engine, I think Shelley can do that for you, but of course there is a price to do that. I believe she rebuilds engines. I'd contact her to find out. I'd soak it for a couple days in Acetone to help cut through the Castor, then what it couldn't remove soak in heated anti-freeze. She may have needles, too.

Regarding gaskets, someone gave me a gasket kit, if you look on the engine it has new ones. Only thing I need to do is remove paint from the head, which someone painted with heat incompatible (turned dark), then spray with Duplicolor Ford Red engine paint.

For me, someone used a non-standard needle on this restored parts engine. It works, but requires further work to really make it work. I was planning to put a short 2-56 screw (I think that is the thread) to blank off where the needle goes. Then give the remote needle a try. I've got nothing to lose and all to gain, LOL.
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  Oldenginerod Mon Feb 02, 2015 7:24 pm

Chellie does good work. Her gasket kits are very good quality. Mecoa has the needles, which are identical to the Series 21 engines, as are the screws. Chellie also gives restoration hints, including restoring poor piston & crankshaft fits.
I had the same problem with the darkening red paint. I suppose doing the 3 heads I have just about justifies buying a can of Duplicolor. I would probably give a light coat of etch primer first.

Rod
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  roddie Mon Feb 02, 2015 7:26 pm

Thanks much George! I'd really like to get this engine running. I remember exactly the model that it was on when I was just a young boy. It was a "Sterling"? Waco Cabin with a beautiful spun aluminum engine cowling! Beige w/red trim. My Dad was more of a "builder" than a flier.. but his models were gorgeous. He doesn't build anymore.. but his last model was a Sterling Monocoupe with an OS .25FP-S white w/red trim that he built about 25 years ago. It's hangared in my brother's garage. My brother wants me to take it.. so I'll have some photos of it soon. I actually have the plan and kit-box for it here.
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  Oldenginerod Tue Feb 03, 2015 3:01 am

Here's what Chellie currently has in her ebay store.
http://www.ebay.com/sch/verysassyblond/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_ipg=&_from=
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  GallopingGhostler Tue Feb 03, 2015 7:00 am

@Oldenginerod wrote:Chellie does good work. Her gasket kits are very good quality.  Mecoa has the needles, which are identical to the Series 21 engines, as are the screws. [...] Chellie also gives restoration hints, including restoring poor piston & crankshaft fits. Here's what Chellie currently has in her ebay store.
http://www.ebay.com/sch/verysassyblond/m.html
Rod, thanks for sharing. I gather that she is quite a gal, provides really useful support to the McCoy engine community, knows her stuff. Amazing thing I found is the head gasket for the McCoy is a paper fiber gasket.

@Oldenginerod wrote:I had the same problem with the darkening red paint. I suppose doing the 3 heads I have just about justifies buying a can of Duplicolor. I would probably give a light coat of etch primer first.
Duplicolor sells an engine paint primer to go with their engine paint. That would be most compatible. I don't think most etching primers are rated for heat.

@roddie wrote:Thanks much George! I'd really like to get this engine running.
Your welcome, Roddie. After relooking over your pictures, that engine isn't as bad as it seems. It just has a lot of burnt Castor glop from a lot of running. That will clean up. You'll also see the remnant of the paper fiber head gasket on the underside of the head.

@roddie wrote:I remember exactly the model that it was on when I was just a young boy. It was a "Sterling"? Waco Cabin with a beautiful spun aluminum engine cowling! Beige w/red trim. My Dad was more of a "builder" than a flier.. but his models were gorgeous.
I had that kit, too. When I left home to join the Army, I left it at home; it disappeared somewhere along the way. The plans are still available, see:

Outerzone: Sterling 33" Kit C-4 Waco SRE CL Plans
Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head 1956

Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head 1956

It doesn't show all formers on the plan, but they wouldn't be difficult to duplicate, given the fuselage cross section is a simple rectangle. In fact, one could simplify the fuselage for easier building today.

@roddie wrote:He doesn't build anymore.. but his last model was a Sterling Monocoupe with an OS .25FP-S white w/red trim that he built about 25 years ago. It's hangared in my brother's garage. My brother wants me to take it.. so I'll have some photos of it soon. I actually have the plan and kit-box for it here.
Roddie, I'd love to see a photo of it. Could this be the kit he built?

Outerzone: Sterling 36" Kit C-1 Monocoupe CL Plans
Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head 5097
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  roddie Tue Feb 03, 2015 7:36 am

@roddie wrote:Thanks much George! I'd really like to get this engine running.
Your welcome, Roddie. After relooking over your pictures, that engine isn't as bad as it seems. It just has a lot of burnt Castor glop from a lot of running. That will clean up. You'll also see the remnant of the paper fiber head gasket on the underside of the head.

@roddie wrote:I remember exactly the model that it was on when I was just a young boy. It was a "Sterling"? Waco Cabin with a beautiful spun aluminum engine cowling! Beige w/red trim. My Dad was more of a "builder" than a flier.. but his models were gorgeous.
I had that kit, too. When I left home to join the Army, I left it at home; it disappeared somewhere along the way. The plans are still available, see:

Outerzone: Sterling 33" Kit C-4 Waco SRE CL Plans
Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head 1956

Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head 1956

It doesn't show all formers on the plan, but they wouldn't be difficult to duplicate, given the fuselage cross section is a simple rectangle. In fact, one could simplify the fuselage for easier building today.

@roddie wrote:He doesn't build anymore.. but his last model was a Sterling Monocoupe with an OS .25FP-S white w/red trim that he built about 25 years ago. It's hangared in my brother's garage. My brother wants me to take it.. so I'll have some photos of it soon. I actually have the plan and kit-box for it here.
Roddie, I'd love to see a photo of it. Could this be the kit he built?

Outerzone: Sterling 36" Kit C-1 Monocoupe CL Plans
Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head 5097[/quote]

Yes George, Thanks! Those are the kits he built.

Here's what's left of the C-1 Monocoupe's plans. I have the cut-out sections in an envelope in the kit-box.

Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head Dsc02432
Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head Kit_bo10
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  Ken Cook Tue Feb 03, 2015 3:45 pm

The Mccoy Red heads, the Series .21, K&B Torp and Greenheads all have the same major design flaw which is the 3 head bolts holding the cylinder on. Combine this with the POS screws they used and the heads pop off and so does the jug. This quickly relinquishes the engine to the garbage can. The Mccoy Redhad .19 only used 2 bolts to retain the cylinder to the case. This happens even more frequently when using the .19 This also happens more with an engine that already has been taken apart due to the goo not retaining the screws. I ask why is your engine apart currently? The above could certainly be a reason. You just can't assume that everything is honky dory with these engines. They're really poorly machined and suffer many flaws such as wrist pins totally crooked through the piston and rods that have been worn due to running them this way. The wrist pin end pads of the Red heads used brass which typically cut grooves into the cylinder wall.  Not that I'm opposed to anyone fixing them, but you can purchase another one for the cost of one of the currently available gasket kits. Thousands of these were made and are all over. Replacing all the screws with 4-40 allen socket heads is a must. The head bolts however are specific to the engine and they would need to be cut from 1" long allen socket heads to approximately 7/8" or they will bottom out. Using a wizz wheel and properly dressing the starting thread is a must or you will ruin the case if threaded in without dressing the end first. I would highly suggest not to clean that piston sleeve unless you want no compression of course. Removing the head gaskets are quite difficult. You could use Ultra Copper RTV which serves a dual purpose. It seals better than the stock head gasket and it also lowers the head which raises the compression slightly. You put it into the recess and let it skin for several minutes prior to assembly. This can also be used on the backplate and base gasket. All of this will seal and raise the compression. Ken
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  GallopingGhostler Tue Feb 03, 2015 8:08 pm

Ken, thanks for your wealth of insight and advice on extending the life of these historic engines. My questions and comments follows:

@Ken Cook wrote:The Mccoy Red heads, the Series .21, K&B Torp and Greenheads all have the same major design flaw which is the 3 head bolts holding the cylinder on. Combine this with the POS screws they used and the heads pop off and so does the jug. This quickly relinquishes the engine to the garbage can.
In normal CL sport stunt usage, these engines are run on mild nitro and higher oil content fuel with significant Castor oil in a 4 cycle breaking to 2 cycle during CL stunt maneuvers.  Props are selected which pull the plane along to maintain reasonable speed but not overload the engine (10x5, 10x6, 9x6). In this mode I am told they work well.

OTOH, older fliers have related to me how they used these McCoys in combat events, some in speed, running high nitro on smaller higher pitched props, they were lucky to get a few flights out of them, and having one grenade wasn't unusual.

Would you say that screws failing and cylinders coming loose were under the more punishing circumstances?

The Mccoy Redhad .19 only used 2 bolts to retain the cylinder to the case. This happens even more frequently when using the .19 This also happens more with an engine that already has been taken apart due to the goo not retaining the screws. I ask why is your engine apart currently? The above could certainly be a reason.
Interesting, I've got one that I've been wanting to mate to the correct airframe. Your point on use of tougher socket head screws would be of greater advantage. Perhaps this is a good argument for the use of low nitro fuels and running slower and rich with props that don't load up this engine.

You just can't assume that everything is honky dory with these engines. They're really poorly machined and suffer many flaws such as wrist pins totally crooked through the piston and rods that have been worn due to running them this way. The wrist pin end pads of the Red heads used brass which typically cut grooves into the cylinder wall.
Wouldn't that be a good reason for gently filing and rounding those? so far, haven't come across the flaws you mention here. Heard that quality varied considerably, some were good, some so-so, some loose. Since they were cheaper than the other make engines, one would buy them up on sales and out of the parts make a good one. Did receive a .35 RH that the nylon crank pin spacer was badly eroded down to a stump. Piston pin end slightly scored and polished the backplate.

Not that I'm opposed to anyone fixing them, but you can purchase another one for the cost of one of the currently available gasket kits. Thousands of these were made and are all over.
That's how I picked up mine. My .19 RH went for a song. When I picked it up, it had never been run, appeared to be stored in someone's tool drawer. I cieaned it up, gently broke it in, now holds speed without slowing. Picked up a .35 RH off E-Bay, little used. Was given another and a parts engine, have 2 good .35's now. If I could find a backplate and prop thrust plate could make the other parts engine a runner.

Replacing all the screws with 4-40 allen socket heads is a must. The head bolts however are specific to the engine and they would need to be cut from 1" long allen socket heads to approximately 7/8" or they will bottom out. Using a wizz wheel and properly dressing the starting thread is a must or you will ruin the case if threaded in without dressing the end first.
Got one engine with those, comes in handy as I can really torque them down. I was having leakages with the other engine because I couldn't get the philips head screws tight enough.

I would highly suggest not to clean that piston sleeve unless you want no compression of course. Removing the head gaskets are quite difficult.
I suppose one could insert for 5 minutes in hot crock anti-freeze and remove liner. (Heat softens congealed Castor). Then clean the rest. Manually clean the cylinder exterior with steel wool or Scotch-Brite pad, leaving the varnish coated interior alone.

You could use Ultra Copper RTV which serves a dual purpose. It seals better than the stock head gasket and it also lowers the head which raises the compression slightly. You put it into the recess and let it skin for several minutes prior to assembly. This can also be used on the backplate and base gasket. All of this will seal and raise the compression. Ken
I've used Permatex Ultra Gray on engine case backs and carb / venturi mounts. Ultra Gray is used on transmission and motorcycle cases, stands up to pressure well. Haven't tried it on the head yet. Might be worth a try.

Only thing is Sassyblonde's kit comes also with the nylon crank throw spacer. One might be able to make one out of some sprue scrap somewhere, like that used as stop pins to hold integrated circuit chips or sockets in their tube holder. I've found that a 1/8" aluminum pop rivet with end polished works, but would want to continue flight testing so I can report results.
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  roddie Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:01 pm

My McCoy .19RH was given to me in pieces by my dad late last year. When I say "in pieces".. I mean that the head was off already.. and there was only one screw with it. Because it was his.. and the fact that I fondly remember the last model that it was mounted on.. (model is LONG gone..)  I'd like to at least restore it to running condition. I understand what Ken means by NOT removing the liner. (best not to awaken a sleeping dog..) Ken has given me the same advice in a PM on replacing the factory screws (all) with high-grade cap-screws.. and I will definitely do that. I can measure for the proper length, cut and dress them with no problem. I was looking at RTV silicone today at the store.. but there was no high-temp formula in stock.

I'm in no hurry to run this engine.. so I'm wondering what would be the best method to "try" to remove the old head gasket material. The head itself could be immersed.. but the case maybe I could invert in a container with maybe a shallow pool (maybe 1/8" deep) of solvent.. and just let it sit for a good long while. Any thoughts?

re-cap pics..

Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head 9-28-111
Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head 9-28-112

I hope that this (below) didn't ruin anything.. I don't know if my dad tried to take this engine apart.. or if someone else did. As you can see (above).. the NVA was also put back incorrectly..
Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head 9-28-113
Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head 9-28-114
Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head 9-28-115
Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head My_dad15
Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head My_dad16
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  GallopingGhostler Tue Feb 03, 2015 9:38 pm

@roddie wrote:My McCoy .19RH was given to me in pieces by my dad late last year. When I say "in pieces".. I mean that the head was off already.. and there was only one screw with it. Because it was his.. and the fact that I fondly remember the last model that it was mounted on.. (model is LONG gone..)  I'd like to at least restore it to running condition. I understand what Ken means by NOT removing the liner. (best not to awaken a sleeping dog..)
Roddie, the cylinder is steel, you can gently scrape the gasket off with a flat screw driver tip. Soaking the head in solvent and/or crockpot with antifreeze will help soften and remove the gasket material, but it also removes the red paint. A Scotchbrite pad will remove gasket material off aluminum without harming the surface. The CL community has found that Duplicolor Engine Paint #DE1605 Ford Red is a good match. Although it is not totally fuel proof, it holds up reasonably well.

Got 2 blackened paint heads, when I clean them removing the paint, I just might leave them in bare aluminum. Foxes, Enyas and OS have bare aluminum heads, another on a McCoy just makes maintenance easier for me.

If lets say that you did disturb the cylinder's varnish build up and it seriously lost compression, it could be built back up with Castor oil only fuel. That's what folks would do in the old days. I've been able to start low/no compression engines, such as a worn out Enya by squirting 40 weight motor oil from a squirt can into the combustion chamber to restore the seal for starting. Amazingly, once started it ran as strong as one with good compression.

There is a following of McCoy engine users on Stunt Hangar, http://stunthanger.com/

I'd post what you posted here and get their opinions, too. There is an amazing bit of history on these engines with all sorts of varying opinions and good support out there, too.

Regarding that tank back, why don't you just remove those screws and take a peak inside? I doubt seriously anything bad occurred. It is just a flat back. the diimple in the back helps with providing more efficient fuel/air mixture transfer as it increases the bypass port's volume, being a part of it.
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  roddie Wed Feb 04, 2015 7:50 am

Thank You for the advice George. I'll post some photos when I proceed with the work.
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  pkrankow Wed Feb 04, 2015 12:45 pm

If you want the compression can be restored by cooking it with a torch, or peening the piston dome lightly, then lapping the piston to the cylinder again.  There are specifics on Stunthanger, never done it myself.

http://stunthanger.com/smf/index.php/topic,32860.0.html

You can also prime the exhaust with heavy gear oil then fuel.  This will restore compression for a couple revolutions, then at 9k rpm there isn't enough time to bleed down.

http://stunthanger.com/smf/index.php/topic,36442.msg371736.html#msg371736

I would try bench running after cleaning and see what happens.

Phil
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  Ken Cook Wed Feb 04, 2015 3:51 pm

All I ever had when I entered this hobby was these engines. They really fascinated me actually. The problem is they're poorly built and one needs to accept that. No matter how much castor you put in it, it's not going to resolve or RESTORE the run   You need a good fit for an engine to work. Good fit and Mccoy don't belong in the same sentence. So everything here is hearsay until you justify what you have. Does the cylinder wall show signs of wear patterns from the wrist pin? Does it have scratches or grooves, if so throw it out your wasting your time. These engines are a dime a dozen and its easier to buy another working example then to tinker with it. Are the holes in the piston for the wrist pin oblong? Once again, throw it out.  Heating a piston outside of the engine does almost little to nothing. It supposedly relives the internal stress which causes it to expand therefore the need to lap it back in. The majority of these engines don't even have round cylinders and they have an extreme amount of run out. So even if the piston does grow, your lapping it back into a oblong hole. So yes, it will gain compression for a few runs and the high spots wear off and your back to square one. The same thing happens when you tap the dome. This is something I've done and it really is a LAST resort. You can't tap the piston correctly unless you make a fixture to properly support the piston and a tool with a groove in it to allow for the baffle to recess up into it. The method is to tap the top without striking the baffle. This method does nothing more than mushroom the top of the piston and it doesn't do it evenly. Many times it breaks the piston. The .19 is harder to collapse than the .35 piston. Harder and repeated taps are required furthering the chances of breaking the piston.  These piston are comprised of powdered metal heated to high temperatures and compressed. They're very fragile. Many lap them in by using the rod as the tool to twist the piston. These rods are not high quality either and they can twist. Not only can these distort and break the rod but it can place the baffle of the piston incorrectly into the head and chip or shatter the baffle if you twist the rod and it goes unrecognized.

   The bottom line to all of this and I apologize for the topic straying off is that it becomes easier to just buy another engine . These engines as I mentioned are EVERYWHERE. There's nothing fancy about them and another example can be had for less than $20. I pass up freebies all the time. I have no time for an engine that's going to waste my fly time at the field. I go to fly not to putz around all day and pour oil in a engine to get it to run. That's absolutely pointless to me. Roddie, if your not comfortable tackling this engine and you would like someone to evaluate what you have, I'd be more than happy to look at the engine for you. Ken
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  GallopingGhostler Wed Feb 04, 2015 6:21 pm

19 Nov 2010 Stunt Hangar: So what about McCoy Engines?, Bill Little wrote:As has been noted, Bart Kaplinski used a McCoy .40RH to win the NATS.  Ed Southwick used them in his Skylarks.  Jim Kostecky used the .40RH in his Formula S.  Dennis Adamisin used a .40RH in his Typhoon, IIRC, at least he used one around that time.

I think the biggest knock was caused by many of us running them wide open and on low oil content fuel.  The Red Head series was timed for a 4-2 run.  And the low oil plus over lean runs killed the pistons.  Some were actually bad out of the box due to poor QC.  Fortunately, I only have one .35 that was killed by the above problems.  All the rest still run great.  Tom Lay has been working on McCoy Red Heads for a long time.  He does some things to the pistons to improve life, but the engine basically needs to be new when sent to him.

The last McCoys, the Series 21 line, were all way too heavy for serious stunt fliers to use when they hit the market.  They had a Dyles ring piston which really help longevity!

George Aldrich's McGAS engines were very high quality (and priced! LOL!!) but they will last as long as any other engine of the period, and longer than most!  I have only one, a .40, but it is a sweet classic engine.

All in all, the Red Head .40 may be the best "out of the box" engine to run a 4-2 break.

Big Bear
20 Nov 2010 Stunt Hangar: So what about McCoy Engines?, Jim Thomerson wrote:I flew a Sterling Yak 9 with McCoy RH 35 in OTS and was well pleased with it.  I thought the McCoy 35 was a little more powerful than a Fox stunt 35, but I never flew them in comparable airplanes. I sold of my RH 35's and kept some of my Fox 35's because one can get parts and service for them. I have several McCoy RH 19's; have flown them a lot, and really like them.
20 Nov 2010 Stunt Hangar: So what about McCoy Engines?, Randy Ryan wrote:I've always liked the Red Head, .35 and .29 in particular. Never flew a .40, the only one I ever had I bought Joe Just then traded it to Jim Kraft for some old stuff. I guess part of the reason I had good luck with them is that I had my Dad around who know had to run engines, so lean runs and low oil content weren't problems for me. I ran many of these engines and out of 25 or so I only remember 2 that were bad, one that came that way and one that died while flying, fell flat on its face, the rest were great. I really like these engines, I have a .35 on a CG Shoestring and using 5% 29% castor and an 11-4 Zinger it just make s a swwet combination, steady run. Mentioned here earlier, George Aldrich really thought the design was superior and told me that if Testor's would have had decent QC in place, Fox probably wouild have been 2nd.  Interstingly, the McCoy cranks were a direct replacement for the Torp Green heads and were used to replace the weaker Torp shafts when they broke. Fed the right diet and not run lean, these engines are really very nice to fly with, I still have a number of NIA (New In Air) .35s and .29s that I will use and look forward to it.
25 Nov 2010 Stunt Hangar: So what about McCoy Engines?, Chris McMillin wrote:My loops and eights and inverted flight came with a 60's red head McCoy 19 powered Veco Warrior when I was really young, and little. I would start that 19 with a chicken stick on the first few flips. Dad mixed our fuel and I know it had a lot of castor. My McCoy had a Tatone Peace Pipe on it too, never got hot, always had enough power, even with a 9x6, which I usually cut off to an 8 inch when Dad wasn't looking. Chris...
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  Ken Cook Wed Feb 04, 2015 7:21 pm

George, I don't know exactly why you posted that, but I can certainly expand on many of what is written there. I own one of Ed Southwick's Skylark's. I believe it maybe  from around 69 or  71. It indeed was powered by a Mccoy .35. I even flew it. I've been in the process of restoring it for several years now. Let me comment on that plane. It was a horrible flying plane. It was completely underpowered with the Mccoy and it weighed a god awful ton. The controls were not what one would expect from a competitive airplane and I had to completely and thoroughly rebuild the entire control system. Dick Mccoy and Ed were also friends. Essentially Ed was getting the best fitting and running engines they could provide. Don't assume that this is how they all ran because that wasn't the case.  My point is don't believe everything you read.

As for George Aldrich, he was one of the best and a good machinist to boot. He was a personal friend of one of my flying acquaintances and I also have some George memorabilia. When George assembled an engine he either made the parts or found the best fitting parts available. George's engines can not be compared to a store bought $4.95 engine.

I own many of these engines and I do enjoy them. I'm just explaining the good and bad points. Unfortunately, there's more bad than good. Just another bad point while were on a roll is the cylinder heads which the threads love to strip out of. I have at least 5 of them that have done that.  We can argue this back and forth forever. I have some that I acquired from my father which he purchased in the late 50's and I also have some that he bought in the mid 60's which I watched  a brand new out of the blister bubble on ONE run self destruct. My father bought these by the dozens. His theory was like many, if the engine made it through a weekend of flying it was well worth it. You threw it out if it didn't and grabbed another.  My experience with these engines isn't based on owning one example. At one time I owned about 12 of each. This is all I have left now which are running examples. I have almost twice what's in the picture just in parts engines. I can tell you first hand this isn't the situation with my Fox's.

Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head Dscn2324

Here's various engines .19's, .29's, .35's. My other red heads are currently on planes.

Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head Dscn2325
Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head Dscn2326
Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head Ed_s_s10
My plane was painted in Aero Gloss red but someone had replaced the outboard wing panel with iron on covering. The entire plane was silkspan and paint. This took numerous hours to pick it off one little piece at a time. The plane was incredibly oil soaked and various dutchman repairs had to be made throughout. This is one project that took longer than it would've taken to build an entire plane. I will not do that to myself again.
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  GallopingGhostler Wed Feb 04, 2015 9:34 pm

Ken, with the exception of one Testors McCoy .19 RH I had on a Sterling Profile P-51 in the 1970's with limited flights, I'm a late comer to the McCoys and thus can only relate to the engines I have, and my recent experiences with them. I've been told by others that they are sensitive to abuse and don't take abuse well. I can't boast of the hours running them because I certainly don't have that, but what I have experienced so far, and that by judiciously following the advice of others in the care and feeding of them, seem to do well so far. Since these engines have created quite a love/hate stir on forums, I've been inquisitively seeking answers. I received the following reply from Bill Little, who uses them quite extensively, along with several others. Here is what Bill had to say:

Bill Little (AKA Big Bear) wrote:Hi George,

I have been using Red Head McCoys since 1963.  I think the majority of bad press came from kids and newbies giving no concern for break in, oil content and running style. While there were times when the QA Dept. seemed to be on vacation, it wasn't as wide spread as it seems.

The one major flaw is the soft piston.  I have used almost completely Castor oil at about 28%.  Lately i cut that back to 25% castor - 3% Klotz.  Both from Sig.  Lots of kids used low oil fuel, tweeked the needle to wide open, sometimes overlean, and the piston would just wear out in no time flat.  Tom Lay had the pistons heat treated to help harden them.

Of course, the best solution if you want a "forever engine", is to have the piston/cylinder jug chromed.  George Aldrich did that on a special line of McCoy he built after McCoy closed down.  He called them "McGas Specials".  He totally blue printed them, drilled out the case and pressed in a new main bearing of better material and painted the head black.  I have a NIB .40 McGAS.  George said the McCoy .40 was the best stunt timed engine ever made.  If you have one with good compression, and take care of it, it will last about as long as any other engine from the day.

No, almost all of them are NOT that bad! Smile  A few came through which were poor quality and fits, but that was just how they were.  Ed Southwick (Skylark) only used McCoy .35s and .40s.

Treat them well, and use them!  When they finally go South, get a Series 21 piston and a ring from Frank Bowman for the .29 or .35 or 40.  then u will have one that lasts even longer with no change to the engine run.  And, they ARE smoother running that several of the other vintage engines.

Take Care!
Bill

So, I gather that they are what they are metallurgically. Yes, there were times in its history where QA problems occurred, they have a weak piston that doesn't handle overly lean runs or inadequate content oil fuels well, aren't meant for high nitro fuels, and certainly aren't meant for high speed RPM runs. With a few QA problems excepting, which doesn't seem to affect most of them, run on props within their power curve and run toward the rich side, they will last if one takes reasonable care of them.

Anyway, that is the way that I see them, and I will continue to use them in CL as I see fit for my uses.
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  Mark Boesen Thu Feb 05, 2015 12:10 am

Great thread, I don't have much too add, other then I had a later RH with the lighting bolts on case (mid sixties?) that ran ok, but I also had Foxes that ran better and when I started flying pattern, I wanted more power and I used a Woolard fp40 and a LA .46
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  GallopingGhostler Thu Feb 05, 2015 5:44 am

@Mark Boesen wrote:Great thread, I don't have much too add, other then I had a later RH with the lighting bolts on case (mid sixties?) that ran ok, but I also had Foxes that ran better and when I started flying pattern, I wanted more power and I used a Woolard fp40 and a LA .46
Mark, that later Lightning Bolt red head version is the most desireable, as it's cylinder has webs in the exhaust cut out to support the Series 21 Dykes piston ring. I am told the Series 21 piston will work in this particular engine's sleeve.

I'd have to check threads in other forums or with a friend who's done this, think it is 19 RH that will accept the Series 21 piston and cylinder as a direct drop in fit.

They seem to run smoother and more economical than at least the older Fox 35 Stunt of the 1950's. Ron Cribbs and I were surprised how long my 35 RH flew with an S-1 Ringmaster on a 3 ounce tank. His S-1 with the earlier Fox 35 seemed thirsty on 4 ounces, plus the McCoy didn't vibrate as much as the Fox.

I can't say about the later Foxes. Duke was always making improvements, and it would not surprise me that the later Foxes were better.

One of these days I'll graduate from the 35 sized planes and move up to a 45 class (old 60 class) planes. Until then, I'm having a blast with the larger than 049 CL's. (I still love the 049 stuff, just can't fly them much due to living in "windy city" here in the Southwest.) Beer Cheers
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  roddie Thu Feb 05, 2015 10:33 am

@Ken Cook wrote:
The bottom line to all of this and I apologize for the topic straying off is that it becomes easier to just buy another engine . These engines as I mentioned are EVERYWHERE. There's nothing fancy about them and another example can be had for less than $20. I pass up freebies all the time. I have no time for an engine that's going to waste my fly time at the field. I go to fly not to putz around all day and pour oil in a engine to get it to run. That's absolutely pointless to me. Roddie, if your not comfortable tackling this engine and you would like someone to evaluate what you have, I'd be more than happy to look at the engine for you. Ken

Hi Ken, I very much appreciate the offer.. and thank you, but as I stated; I'm in no hurry to run this .19RH and through reading all these very useful comments here, along with some PM's I've saved from you regarding both; my .19 and .35 McCoy engines.. I should be able to determine whether or not I've got an engine that's worth moving forward with restoring to running condition.

I just removed the back-plate screws with a good fitting Phillips-bit (none of the screws were very tight.. just barely snugged) to have a peak at the bottom-end. The gasket is in surprisingly good shape.. but isn't there a Nylon spacer-pin supposed to be there? The engine doesn't appear to have been run without it.. as the back-plate's inner-face has no wear-marks.

Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head Dsc02433

The piston moves freely.. and with the head off; while rotating the crank.. I can feel a slight resistant suction with the piston and hear a resulting "pop" through it's stroke. There is no detectable play in the rod.. and no visible cylinder scoring from the wrist-pin. These would seem to be good indicators that this engine has some life left in it.
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  Ken Cook Thu Feb 05, 2015 4:00 pm

Absolutely, now get er going!!!!!. Yes the spacer should be in there. Chellie does provide spacers with the gasket kits, they do have to be slightly sanded to fit properly. Some of my older Mccoy's had a brass spacer, but George also mentioned he was using aluminum. Ken
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  chevyiron420 Thu Feb 05, 2015 4:20 pm

I have been told you can make the insert from a plastic screw from the hardware store. i havent done it yet.
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  GallopingGhostler Thu Feb 05, 2015 7:11 pm

Here's my 1/8" aluminum pop rivet crank throw spacer:

Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head Mccoy311

On my spare engine, I trimmed two longer 4-40 screws to 1/8" longer than the factory backplate screws using my stripper crimper multi-tool with small bolt cutters and mounted the Evolution 46 remote NVA on it. Removed someone's homemade needle and after reversing the spray bar, plug the needle hole with a short 2-56 bolt and flat washer.

Please note that the blackened head is due to use of an incompatible non-heat resistant paint. Later I will clean these up and mitigate the cylinder head screws with socket heads. This engine runs fine, but at a slight compression loss because unlike the socket heads, it is difficult to torque down screws versus the socket head screws.

Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head Mccoy312

Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head Mccoy313

During bench running it took a little tweaking to get the new needle adjustmen just right. It runs a nice 4 cycle barely breaking into 2 at 1.75 turns open. This needle works very smoothly, I was able to leave it set and restart keeping the same setting without any further tweaking. Refilled and ran 4 times. It looks like I've got a winner here. Thumbs Up
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

Post  Oldenginerod Thu Feb 05, 2015 8:23 pm

Well done George. That gets the fingers well away from the prop. I guess you found out just how loud these engines are. Last time I ran one of these it came loose from the test stand and slammed the wall at a really high speed. No great damage except a shattered prop. Sad That thing really screamed for a short burst as it flew across the shed extra lean and unloaded. It may have quit just before it hit but it all happened so fast I couldn't tell.

Rod.
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Thinking Re: Evo 40/46 Remote NVA Fits McCoy 35 Red Head

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