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Post  RknRusty Fri Nov 13, 2015 11:36 pm

Yesterday is the first time I've had a chance to test the Oriental since having it grounded in Huntersville with an engine problem. At that time, it had flown well in its first flight after extensive repairs, even 4.5 ounces heavier, but shut off lean and wouldn't re-crank. Upon inspection back at home I removed some material from the filter, no doubt introduced into the system by me in my haste to get ready for the contest. I think it was fuzz from one of my rags that I cleaned out of the filter. So she's been hanging in the shop until now, waiting to be proven airworthy.

It wasn't a great flying day, but the grass needed mowing before this Sunday's excursion and Wayne and I wanted to trim his e-P40 and also see if Watt's old Cardinal, now in my fleet was a flyer. I left the Cowl off the Oriental in case she hiccupped again. Wayne flew, since I'm still gimpy from the Ukey yank. It was rough gusty windy too, and I wasn't going to risk myself and the plane. I didn't tach it, but sent it off just touching on the top of a 4-stroke, and she flew for 9 minutes and sucked the tank dry. Turning about 4 second laps, I was glad I didn't have the handle. Wayne said it pulled really hard and reported soft controls in the couple of loops he did. It ran the same inverted as upright too, still hinting at an off and on 4-stroke during level flight in both directions.

When I flew it in H'ville at it's richer 5 second laps, I noticed a harder pull too, but don't recall thinking the controls were softer. But it wasn't windy that day either. Maybe I need to move the elevator pushrod a notch closer, but that remains to be determined when I can fly it myself. With the added weight it may need more elevator bite than before. As it is, it has more flap than elevator, with the pushrod in the outermost hole. I have an access panel that should allow me in there, but it's such a crappy chinese clevis I've been afraid to spring it open to move it.

The Cardinal needs some work, but seems basically solid. It has Will Davis' LA40 off of his old Ugly Betty Vector that is now electric. The LA seemed happy with a 12x5 Zinger, but was flying nearly 6 second laps, scary in that wind. Couldn't even loop it. I may try an 11" prop next time.

Wayne, Bob and I are going out Sunday. The forecast is for light wind and sunny skies. I'm going to try and find something light to fly. If I can fix the Ukey in time, or maybe borrow its 25fp for the Shoestring and fly that. There's always the Yak, but I've never really flown pattern with it, and of all my sport planes, it's the one I'd least want to wreck. I sort of treasure that plane, which is not recommended for CL planes, but hey, I can't help it, it's one of my favorites. I do look forward to getting the handle back in my hand, but want to be very careful and test my limits. That lawn dart in H'ville was a serious fluke. I have never missed a reverse wingover pullout before, and just went to sleep on that one. It still has me a little spooked.

Mainly I just wanted to let everyone, and especially Ken, know, the plumbing on the Oriental is fine.
I'll report back with a flight summary on Sunday night.
Rusty

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Post  RknRusty Wed Nov 18, 2015 12:12 am

I am still flying without the cowl until I'm sure it's all squared away. Sunday when I flew it, Bob cranked it for me and commented that it seemed awfully high on compression. I tached it at 10.9k, my usual launch RPM, and it flew with a perfect engine run until I exited the hourglass. Then it leaned out and sped up. After a couple of laps, I dared to continue, flew the OH8s and the Clover, after which it was really hauling ass. Many laps later, it finally ran out of gas and landed.

When I got home, I hung it from the prop, where it stayed until today. I took it down without changing its tail-down attitude and unplugged the line from the spraybar nipple. I only drew a scant immeasurable trace of fuel out, so the tank was absolutely empty when it shut off. I unscrewed the filter and checked, and there was no debris at all in the screen. A pressure check confirms the tank and lines hold high pressure for 10 minutes. I'll blow out the spraybar tomorrow, and fly it as-is next time. Bob suggests adding a head gasket which I don't have unless the one from a .25fp fits, or can be made to fit. I'll fly it again before I order one. It's not like i'm in a rush, no contests until May, so I can fiddle with it. Btw, during the early part of the flight while it's operating normally, there is no change in performance between upright and inverted.
Rusty

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Post  getback Wed Nov 18, 2015 7:39 am

Rusty if your going to fly it with the cowl on should you not be testing it that way ? Is it a 3 hole spray bar, the engine surly didn't heat up if it ran the tank dry in a lean condition. Good to hear your back with the big planes again kina like taking hydrocodone over aspirin . lol! getback Very Happy
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Post  RknRusty Wed Nov 18, 2015 10:44 am

getback wrote:Rusty if your going to fly it with the cowl on should you not be testing it that way ? Is it a 3 hole spray bar, the engine surly didn't heat up if it ran the tank dry in a lean condition. Good to hear your back with the big planes again kina like taking hydrocodone over aspirin . lol!  getback Very Happy  

Lol, comparing flying to narcotics. Sounds like a recipe for a lawn dart.

Nah, if it runs right without the cowl, and overheats with the cowl, I'll bore holes in it until it cools or disappears. It's just a simple one hole, thru-venturi spraybar. Eric, I'm not making any assumptions based on one flight, I just thought it was something interesting to write. I write like some people talk... you know, they just won't shut up. I'm guilty of such. My fingers twitch as my brain thinks, and text just blurts out across the Internet.
Rusty

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Post  Ken Cook Wed Nov 18, 2015 2:51 pm

We need to get you another head for the Fp. Send it to Bob and let Bob hemi out the new head. He's very experienced at this mod and it takes him very little time. Ken


         Reading your post again, I don't feel that the engine should've been going lean at the hourglass. You might be getting some fuel foaming going on due to vibrations. The r/c type mount could certainly expedite that. If your not using Armor All in your fuel currently, I would give your jug a spritz and try again. I have also seen the venturi o-ring become a suspect due to the engine heating up at this point and not sealing correctly at the base of the venturi allowing a air leak.  Uniflow should keep this problem from occurring but if it is indeed vibes it won't. If it's happening from getting hot, I would take a closer look at your tongue muffler. If I recall you were using a RSM tongue which does have very small holes. This is why the FP can be somewhat troublesome to diagnose. The fact that the plane suffered structural damage leads me to believe vibrations are not in your favor. The plane has also picked up a considerable amount of weight which could certainly change things equally. Have you tried to open the needle 1 click after a flight and refly? I'm not suggesting to regulate speed of the plane by the speed of the engine, just to try and get a bit more fuel through it due to having several laps in the end. I would strive for 8-10 laps after the clover prior to landing. If your seeing several laps now in the cooler months, your going to have a lot more in the summer months due to leaning the engine up.
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Post  RknRusty Wed Nov 18, 2015 8:39 pm

Hi Ken,
You've trained me well. Those were all thoughts running through my head while I was laying hands on the Oriental this afternoon. I have, in fact been treating my fuel with, not Armoral, but Son-of-a-Gun. Same surfactant I think. I've been using it since my early 1/2A days. As rigid as I tried to make the repairs, worry of vibes was nagging me too. The APC prop is extremely well balanced, one of the best I've done.

I need more flights to see if I really have a problem. I remember freaking out and causing a thread to mushroom over a lean run once before, and it was nothing but a fluke, probably a blade of dry winter grass, and I wasted a lot of helpful people's time. What I do know is the plumbing is 100% airtight. I checked again today. A tank position problem would have exposed itself during my inverted flight, but it was all fine until after the HG.

I have not checked the venturi gasket yet, though the possibility didn't escape me. I'll look tomorrow.

I have two extra rows of holes bored in the RSM Tongue muffler, and three 3/32" holes in addition to those. I usually gauge the temperature after a flight by wrapping my fingers around the aluminum spinner backplate, and it felt what I call normal after this one. This .40 ran like a piped expert engine before the wreck. If it keeps running away, I'm thinking vibration. I think I'll make an extra head gasket too

I'll probably fly it in Huntersville Saturday and try to ignore the massive peanut gallery of advice while I do Lol. I am also going to fly the Shoestring, as I never got to it this past weekend.
Rusty

Ken Cook wrote:We need to get you another head for the Fp. Send it to Bob and let Bob hemi out the new head. He's very experienced at this mod and it takes him very little time. Ken


         Reading your post again, I don't feel that the engine should've been going lean at the hourglass. You might be getting some fuel foaming going on due to vibrations. The r/c type mount could certainly expedite that. If your not using Armor All in your fuel currently, I would give your jug a spritz and try again. I have also seen the venturi o-ring become a suspect due to the engine heating up at this point and not sealing correctly at the base of the venturi allowing a air leak.  Uniflow should keep this problem from occurring but if it is indeed vibes it won't. If it's happening from getting hot, I would take a closer look at your tongue muffler. If I recall you were using a RSM tongue which does have very small holes. This is why the FP can be somewhat troublesome to diagnose. The fact that the plane suffered structural damage leads me to believe vibrations are not in your favor. The plane has also picked up a considerable amount of weight which could certainly change things equally.  Have you tried to open the needle 1 click after a flight and refly? I'm not suggesting to regulate speed of the plane by the speed of the engine, just to try and get a bit more fuel through it due to having several laps in the end. I would strive for 8-10 laps after the clover prior to landing. If your seeing several laps now in the cooler months, your going to have a lot more in the summer months due to leaning the engine up.

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while you're doing it!


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