Re: Fuel supply for my TD, questions and answers

Mark Boesen Sun Nov 27, 2011 6:08 pm

Here's a more detailed description of the starting method I had previously mentioned, except I'd use hemostats to close off fuel line. I'm sure there's other ways to do, but this always worked for me.

http://www.clcombat.info/bladder.html

**RknRusty** Sun Nov 27, 2011 6:08 pm

Yeah, Cribbs, that's what I'm talking about. I followed your instructions to the Tee and it works perfect, you just have to sneak up on it. I have a spring starter, so that helps. If I get out of rhythm and let too much fuel in, I just close it and burn it off and start over again. But that hasn't happened except for my first time.

I always thought it was a complicated dance getting a TD on pressure cranked. Granted, this isn't as much pressure as the guys that pump up surgical tubing use. What would be the benefit in that? My engine settles in at about 3 turns on the NV and never wavers, nose up, nose down upside down and shaking it violently to try foaming the fuel. Even a bubble here and there doesn't make it stumble.

I took it out and flew and the engine never changes speed no matter what I do. And I did badly. I have always balanced planes with an empty tank. Bad idea with this configuration. I was using a 6x4 Top-Flite, I figured it would chop through the wind and not fly too fast. When it took off, it shot straight up for the heavens and was determined to stay there. If I got anywhere near level, she would make a rapid plunge for the ground. On my first flight I started getting a little better control and tried a loop. Another bad idea, a full power figure 9. So I hosed her off and launched again with only the remaining fuel hoping the balance would gradually come as the fuel depleted. This time I flew a bunch of inverted laps, still flying like I was hanging onto a wild pig, but it ran just as good upside down as right side up. Unfortunately I thought I could level off and it plowed it into the ground of its own mind and busted the rudder off. It's probably been of before, this plane is going on 14 years old.

No problem, CA glue fixed that and I wired a few nuts and washers under the engine until it was slightly nose heavy. Should fly like that and be fine with the tank at any level. I was excited now. I was going to give y'all a stunt show. Then I realized the needle was bent badly. I tried to straighten it out but it was FUBAR. I have to get another one before I can use pressure again. So I was about to drain the fuel and shot myself with a high pressure blast, luckily in the chest. Safety glasses always from now on. In fact Bare warned me about that some time ago over at RCG.

All this, embarrassing as my piloting today was, will be documented on my YouTube channel later tonight. Lucky for me, I have some videos to prove I really can fly a plane. Rolling Eyes

After I post this I'm going to stitch it together and upload it. I'll post the link when it's up. Meanwhile you can look at my channel, The button under my avatar will take you there.

Here's what it looks like:

A double balloon inside a 1.5 ounce turkey baster. It has a perforated tube that reaches all the way to the back of the balloon. There's probably a picture of that in another thread.
Fuel supply for my TD, questions and answers - Page 2 1127111327

Fuel supply for my TD, questions and answers - Page 2 1127111327

Mounted under the wing
Fuel supply for my TD, questions and answers - Page 2 1127111340

My old beater, formally named Green Death. I cut the fuse short after it broke too many times, and that's when she became such a sweet flyer. My son actually crashed it in the ocean once. But after repairs the pretty new paint job and the Ultracote to reinforce the outboard wing(my nieces broke it, that's in my channel too)made it too heavy to fly with a Black Widow. It was a joy to fly. I think anyone could do stunts with this baby, it just went anywhere I pointed it. And if it got away from you, if you just didn't panic, she'd come right back to you. I don't think she'll ever fly like that again.
Fuel supply for my TD, questions and answers - Page 2 SAM_0654-1

Fuel supply for my TD, questions and answers - Page 2 SAM_0654-1

fit90 Sun Nov 27, 2011 6:33 pm

Cool,

It's great to hear the experimentation is paying such great dividends. Thanks for sharing.

Bob

**RknRusty** Sun Nov 27, 2011 7:10 pm

fit90 wrote:Cool,

It's great to hear the experimentation is paying such great dividends. Thanks for sharing.

Bob

Ha! Just wait till you see the video. It's uploading now.

microflitedude Sun Nov 27, 2011 7:13 pm

RknRusty wrote:That was TOO easy!
I wiped the memory on my camera and I'm off to fly. See ya later.

Would have joined you, but was too busy helping cut and install Formica in the bathroom. Shocked

Mark Boesen Sun Nov 27, 2011 7:58 pm

It sounds like you had a good time at the field today, I'll look forward to seeing the video.

Congrats on the Gamecocks win, it will be interesting to see where they go bowling!

**RknRusty** Sun Nov 27, 2011 8:10 pm

microflitedude wrote:
RknRusty wrote:That was TOO easy!
I wiped the memory on my camera and I'm off to fly. See ya later.

Would have joined you, but was too busy helping cut and install Formica in the bathroom.

Ah well, maybe we can hook up next weekend. I found out what was wrong with the Black widow on the Li'l Jumpin' Bean, the one that had such wonky needle settings when we flew the other week. That's the engine I have to seal with Permatex... there was a piece that had come loose and got sucked up into the pickup tube. It was stuck to the spring and must've been moving around in there. I'm glad to know, because that was the best running one I have.

**RknRusty** Sun Nov 27, 2011 8:21 pm

Mark Boesen wrote:It sounds like you had a good time at the field today, I'll look forward to seeing the video.

Congrats on the Gamecocks win, it will be interesting to see where they go bowling!

As awful as my piloting was, I proved what I set out to do. The bladder tank works flawlessly.

Thanks for the congrats. With our luck, we'll probably draw one of those damn triple option teams. The OBC wants to go to the Cotton Bowl. He says he's never been to that one. I don't know what conferences they usually draw from. We're 10-2 this year, Spurrier has finally turned around the football culture here. We've always had rabid fans, but never could break into the top tier. I think he has us on our way.

Ray Tanner and the baseball team has shown us we can win at USC too. Back to back NCs for our Gamecock baseball team. We closed Rosenblatt with the NC win over UCLA and opened the new park with a win over our own SEC East rival, Florida. Had to beat Clemson twice to get there too. It's been a good year to be a Gamecock!

**RknRusty** Sun Nov 27, 2011 9:03 pm

Here is the link to the HD video.

For whatever reason the HD links won't display a window.

**RknRusty** Sun Nov 27, 2011 9:09 pm

fit90 wrote:Cool,

It's great to hear the experimentation is paying such great dividends. Thanks for sharing.

Bob

Bob, what brand is that NVA? I need to order a new needle for it. Is it a Texas Timers, or does it matter as long as it's 128 TPI?

PV Pilot Sun Nov 27, 2011 9:39 pm

Good Job Rusty.

yeah, Nitro in the eyes is just like pepper spray. DO NOT light a smoke if you get a big blast in the face obviously. Shower or wash off first. The nitro burning is not so bad,, it burns off fairly quick. The bad stuff is the methanol that you cannot see burning, it shows as just a heat wave with no real visible flame unless the light hits it just right.

Mark Boesen Sun Nov 27, 2011 10:08 pm

Nice video!

I'm jealous, I haven't picked up a handle in a long time, I could sense the excitement of flight just watching! I think I'll do some building this winter!

fit90 Mon Nov 28, 2011 9:08 am

Rusty,

I am not 100% positive what brand it is but I would bet even money it is either from Texas tTimers or compatible with theirs.

Bob

**RknRusty** Mon Nov 28, 2011 10:57 am

That's what Dankar said, KirnKraft sold the design to Texas Timers. They are reasonable at $15, so I'll get one. I might buy another one next month too so I have a spare, and an aluminum carb body. I need to figure out a way to protect the needle, like building some planes with the right nose for TDs and Medallions.

Even though it was ugly flying, I'm glad I had success with the bladder tank. Now I know I can be flying while I experiment with the other fuel supply methods. I kinda had a learning curve to overcome when you gave me those hot new engines.

**RknRusty** Mon Nov 28, 2011 11:07 am

Mark Boesen wrote:Nice video!

I'm jealous, I haven't picked up a handle in a long time, I could sense the excitement of flight just watching! I think I'll do some building this winter!

Yeah, that was a couple of pretty wild flights, like I said, kind of like wrasslin' a wild pig hoping the gas will run out. I made a bad decision to fly again without adding nose weight. It's heck of a lot easier if the plane is balanced, as is somewhat evident in my other videos. Strange, I can fly upright with no dizziness, but inverted still makes me dizzy. Now that my plane will run upside down I'll get over it.

I love C/L, it's affordable and I have more fun than the R/C guys believe is possible. But I want to get an inexpensive toy R/C plane and see if I can learn to handle it. If there is such a thing.

**Cribbs74** Mon Nov 28, 2011 11:57 am

RknRusty wrote:
Mark Boesen wrote:Nice video!

I'm jealous, I haven't picked up a handle in a long time, I could sense the excitement of flight just watching! I think I'll do some building this winter!
Yeah, that was a couple of pretty wild flights, like I said, kind of like wrasslin' a wild pig hoping the gas will run out. I made a bad decision to fly again without adding nose weight. It's heck of a lot easier if the plane is balanced, as is somewhat evident in my other videos. Strange, I can fly upright with no dizziness, but inverted still makes me dizzy. Now that my plane will run upside down I'll get over it.

I love C/L, it's affordable and I have more fun than the R/C guys believe is possible. But I want to get an inexpensive toy R/C plane and see if I can learn to handle it. If there is such a thing.

Nice video Rusty! I always enjoy watching your exploits. I am also glad a newb like me was able to offer some assistance to getting that TD started.

BTW that starting procedure works on all TD displacements. I have never been able to start one using the method in the Cox instruction manual, pressure or no pressure. Let us know how the fine thread NVA works out.

1/2A RC is relatively inexpensive as it's usually only 2-3 channels and most kit designs are simple and cheap. Plus you can use the Cox engines you already have. Buy used and I bet you can get one up in the air for 50-75 bucks.

PV Pilot Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:10 pm

RknRusty wrote:That's what Dankar said, KirnKraft sold the design to Texas Timers. .

I was thinking that little rubber boot looked exactly similar to the KK boot.

**RknRusty** Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:32 pm

cribbs74 wrote:Nice video Rusty! I always enjoy watching your exploits. I am also glad a newb like me was able to offer some assistance to getting that TD started.

BTW that starting procedure works on all TD displacements. I have never been able to start one using the method in the Cox instruction manual, pressure or no pressure. Let us know how the fine thread NVA works out.

1/2A RC is relatively inexpensive as it's usually only 2-3 channels and most kit designs are simple and cheap. Plus you can use the Cox engines you already have. Buy used and I bet you can get one up in the air for 50-75 bucks.

Man I think I inspired more people with that rough ugly ride yesterday than I do with my pretty flights. Very Happy

There is some fun to be had holding on to one that has a mind of its own, you never know where it's going next. Too bad about that ground thing. Laughing

I had no problem starting it with your instructions. I was expecting it to be difficult, but it works great. I hope I have my new NV next weekend. I'll put on a nice pretty stunt exhibition for y'all.

I put the Medallion on the Jumpin Bean so she's ready for a test flight too, only my 3/8 ounce tank only lasts a minute. If Brodak is fast enough I'll have a new wedge for it soon. And the Li'l Satan's BW is back in action, so I'll be flying something.

PV Pilot Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:42 pm

RknRusty wrote:

Man I think I inspired more people with that rough ugly ride yesterday than I do with my pretty flights. Very Happy

There is some fun to be had holding on to one that has a mind of its own, you never know where it's going next. Too bad about that ground thing. Laughing

I had no problem starting it with your instructions. I was expecting it to be difficult, but it works great. I hope I have my new NV next weekend. I'll put on a nice pretty stunt exhibition for y'all.[/quote]

"Ladies and Gentlemen,,eye's right off of show stage center for Cap'n Rockin Rusty and his Wild Pig demonstration,,please don all saftey gear that was handed out at the main gate for your saftey,, resist the urge and stay clear of the concrete bunkers as those are reserved for judges..fasten you ez chair seatbelts,, here we go!!". Popcorn

**RknRusty** Mon Nov 28, 2011 9:22 pm

PV Pilot wrote:
RknRusty wrote:Man I think I inspired more people with that rough ugly ride yesterday than I do with my pretty flights. There is some fun to be had holding on to one that has a mind of its own, you never know where it's going next. Too bad about that ground thing.
I had no problem starting it with your instructions. I was expecting it to be difficult, but it works great. I hope I have my new NV next weekend. I'll put on a nice pretty stunt exhibition for y'all.

"Ladies and Gentlemen,,eye's right off of show stage center for Cap'n Rockin Rusty and his Wild Pig demonstration,,please don all saftey gear that was handed out at the main gate for your saftey,, resist the urge and stay clear of the concrete bunkers as those are reserved for judges..fasten you ez chair seatbelts,, here we go!!".

Fuel supply for my TD, questions and answers - Page 2 Rofl

Haha! I'm honored. I promise to give y'all a great multi plane show. If the weather is right and Texas Timers is prompt, maybe I'll do it this weekend.

I just bought a pair of short needles for $5 each from Texas Timers and enough stuff to kit up a couple of quality bladders. I did some good reading on the clcombat.info website. They have lots of good information about bladder equipment. Dang, I gotta pee...

...I'm back. Too bad I don't have a fine thread spraybar on the Medallion yet, but It can wait. I'll revisit the zero pressure bladder for it. I'll lay a balloon in the first outboard rib bay on the Bean. Or maybe a latex un-lubed condom instead of a balloon. I couldn't possibly ask my beautiful pharmacist if they sell small ones. Embarassed

dckrsn Mon Nov 28, 2011 9:49 pm

Rusty,

Last week or so, you mentioned having a few "postage stamp" backplates.

They have 128tpi needles that might be worth trying.

In fact, may be the same as the Texas Timers ones.

I fit one of the T.T. needle valve assemblies into an OK Cob .049b and it runs like a dream.

Bob

**RknRusty** Mon Nov 28, 2011 10:23 pm

dckrsn wrote:Rusty,

Last week or so, you mentioned having a few "postage stamp" backplates.

They have 128tpi needles that might be worth trying.

In fact, may be the same as the Texas Timers ones.

I fit one of the T.T. needle valve assemblies into an OK Cob .049b and it runs like a dream.

Bob

How about that, I was about to mail those backplates to one of our members. I just pulled one out of the envelope and looked at it and it looks like it is a fine thread. I'll have to see if I can rummage up some more. It's a good short needle too. Thanks for bringing that to my attention.

Mark Boesen Mon Nov 28, 2011 11:09 pm

Bob you're a genius!

I saw you post and thought hmm...grabbed a couple needles and look for yourself. I don't see why they won't work.

A lot of older 1/2a's have 128TPI needles: Wen-Macs, Cubs, Andersons, Atwood/Holland but different tapers, but these look very close.

Fuel supply for my TD, questions and answers - Page 2 00112

dckrsn Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:07 pm

Happy to contribute to our hobby guys. Very Happy

Bob

nitroairplane Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:12 pm

dckrsn wrote:Happy to contribute to our hobby guys.

Bob

Bpb you are a genius this opens up a world of mis matched oportunities and looks Huh...

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