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Cox Engine of The Month
Two Gilberts with mufflers
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Two Gilberts with mufflers
My apologies to all that may have bid on these ebay offered engines. Ever since I saw Kim’s examples I had to have one or two. As these came with mufflers and looked in great shape I could not resist.
Now I have to find a suitable plane to put them on both in scale and design. Any suggestions?
They won't work on a P-38, but some other twin? Or two singles?
Now I have to find a suitable plane to put them on both in scale and design. Any suggestions?
They won't work on a P-38, but some other twin? Or two singles?
rsv1cox- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
Bob,
We used to post engines we were bidding on so we didn't compete against one another. Not sure where that practice went, but it ensured the prices stayed low and allowed folks to get what they want.
Hope you enjoy the Gilberts.
Ron
We used to post engines we were bidding on so we didn't compete against one another. Not sure where that practice went, but it ensured the prices stayed low and allowed folks to get what they want.
Hope you enjoy the Gilberts.
Ron
Cribbs74- Moderator
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
Cribbs74 wrote:Bob,
We used to post engines we were bidding on so we didn't compete against one another. Not sure where that practice went, but it ensured the prices stayed low and allowed folks to get what they want.
Hope you enjoy the Gilberts.
Ron
That's a good practice Ron and one I have alluded to before. I really don't need any more engines and would willingly fail to bid or back off any auction if I knew another member was interested and/or bidding.
I did buy one of the Gilberts that was put together from parts, reasonably priced at $25.00. But I mainly just wanted the wrench that comes with it.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/321577935993?_trksid=p2060778.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
These both are .074's I understand that these are not the best running engines, but they are distinctive and have a history.
rsv1cox- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
http://brodak.com/control-line-kits/brodak/1-2-a-series/f82-twin-mustang-kit.html
This or something with a similar size, maybe slightly larger, wing.
Phil
This or something with a similar size, maybe slightly larger, wing.
Phil
pkrankow- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
What's the wrench looks like? I have a lot of wrenches that don't have a purpose. If I have a Gilbert one you can have it.
Cribbs74- Moderator
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rsv1cox- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
pkrankow wrote:http://brodak.com/control-line-kits/brodak/1-2-a-series/f82-twin-mustang-kit.html
This or something with a similar size, maybe slightly larger, wing.
Phil
Yes, that profile twin Mustang would be a good fit. Maybe a B-25 or as I have a third one coming, a Ford tri motor. Now I'm just dreaming.
rsv1cox- Top Poster
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rsv1cox- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
rsv1cox wrote:My apologies to all that may have bid on these ebay offered engines. Ever since I saw Kim’s examples I had to have one or two
Always a pleasure to assist/inspire my fellow forum buds to spend their hard-earned cash !!!
Kim- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
The wrench is indeed designed for both engines- .074 head one end and .11 head the other, plus both prop nut sizes. I have numerous Gilbert wrenches and could have spared one.
It's worth noting that both engines you bought have both left side mufflers fitted. The pipes should be parallel to each other but angled to the engine so that they stay parallel to the fuselage when mounted with offset.
Just to note, I did bid on these also, but already have a half dozen Gilberts so losing doesn't worry me. The seller wanted a fortune for International postage, but agreed to "reduce" the cost if I won, without giving me a solid figure. I hate that!!
Rod.
It's worth noting that both engines you bought have both left side mufflers fitted. The pipes should be parallel to each other but angled to the engine so that they stay parallel to the fuselage when mounted with offset.
Just to note, I did bid on these also, but already have a half dozen Gilberts so losing doesn't worry me. The seller wanted a fortune for International postage, but agreed to "reduce" the cost if I won, without giving me a solid figure. I hate that!!
Rod.
Oldenginerod- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
rsv1cox wrote:Maybe this?
.074 To much engine? Maybe not.
Gilbert .074 seems to put out about the same amount of power as a Cox .049 Babe Bee. Practical RPM's versus prop size may be found in the thread:
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/glow-engines-114/11586651-club-c-gilbert.html
EarlWB on his Gilbert .074 using 1/2-A Glowboy Fuel and what looks like a Masters 6x3 prop turned 11.7k RPM. Controlliner stated he was getting around 16k RPM with his well broken in one. That Blackhawk kit looks like someone is using Gilberts for power, judging by the large spring starter front prop washer casting. I am told that they start and run best upright. If we had calmer skies here in New Mexico, I would have substituted the Gilbert just to see how well it performs on a 20" CL profile job I already have built.
Basically this is (flying small reedie CL in NM) wishful thinking.
GallopingGhostler- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
Thanks GG, I did link to that thread and found Earl's and your inputs. Reading that thread was like asking for a drink of water and someone hosing you down with a fire hose, but I read it all and loved every minute of it. Booked it too.
and Rod, buzz me when your into something ebayish and I will hesitate..... . But I have spent my lunch money there for awhile so I'm on an extended ebay pause.
Interesting about the left hand mufflers, I did not know they were different. Learned a lot from GG's link. Somewhere someone has too many right handers. What problems will that cause me?
and Rod, buzz me when your into something ebayish and I will hesitate..... . But I have spent my lunch money there for awhile so I'm on an extended ebay pause.
Interesting about the left hand mufflers, I did not know they were different. Learned a lot from GG's link. Somewhere someone has too many right handers. What problems will that cause me?
rsv1cox- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
rsv1cox wrote:Thanks GG, I did link to that thread and found Earl's and your inputs. Reading that thread was like asking for a drink of water and someone hosing you down with a fire hose, but I read it all and loved every minute of it. Booked it too.
and Rod, buzz me when your into something ebayish and I will hesitate..... . But I have spent my lunch money there for awhile so I'm on an extended ebay pause.
Interesting about the left hand mufflers, I did not know they were different. Learned a lot from GG's link. Somewhere someone has too many right handers. What problems will that cause me?
No problems with the ebay thing. All's fair..... I shouldn't be buying anything from over there anyway due to the current exchange rate of $1 AUD = $0.85 USD. Last year we were getting more for our dollar in the exchange so I bought quite a few when I had the chance of saving a few $$.
I did get a Gilbert 11 a while ago with 2 RH mufflers, (Sorry, they don't interchange with the 7), which is a common practice for R/C or free flight without engine offset. It also directs castor away from the plane, wheras yours will concentrate it back towards the plane, making a mess.
Rod.
Oldenginerod- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
rsv1cox wrote:Interesting about the left hand mufflers, I did not know they were different. Learned a lot from GG's link. Somewhere someone has too many right handers. What problems will that cause me?
As oldenginerod shared, it shouldn't cause you problems, except perhaps the exhaust spray may be directed more inward toward the fuselage if you have side thrust; both sides if no side thrust. You may be able to link up with someone who has two right hand exhausts and do an exchange. With the proper right hand and left hand exhausts, the exhaust gases will be directed straight behind and evenly on both sides with the appropriate side thrust.
One thing Steve has been offering lately for a reasonable price is Gilbert .074 glow heads, which are a hard find.
GallopingGhostler- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
What you got as a muffler depends on when & where you got it, apparently. I got my .07's from Polk's when Gilbert went out of business. A couple were kits in a bag, others were literally broken off RTF's and bagged. One even had a screw and a piece of plastic still on the mounting lug.
My Gilbert .11 is from a yard sale and is missing the drive washer, prop washer and nut. I used these items from a steel fin Fox .15 when I ran it.
Back to the muffler, these appear to be Gilbert's equivalent to a "Tongue" muffler.
George
My Gilbert .11 is from a yard sale and is missing the drive washer, prop washer and nut. I used these items from a steel fin Fox .15 when I ran it.
Back to the muffler, these appear to be Gilbert's equivalent to a "Tongue" muffler.
George
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
rsv1cox wrote:My apologies to all that may have bid on these ebay offered engines. Ever since I saw Kim’s examples I had to have one or two. As these came with mufflers and looked in great shape I could not resist.
Now I have to find a suitable plane to put them on both in scale and design. Any suggestions?
They won't work on a P-38, but some other twin? Or two singles?
Hi Bob, I was thinking about twins for your Gilberts. If you like to scatch-build.. and I'm assuming a control line model. May I suggest something obscure..? Edit: sorry.. I forgot to tell you what it is.. It's a British "Westland Whirlwind" heavy fighter.. and was one of the fastest aircraft in British service in the late 1930's. Power was Rolls Royce Peregrine's.
I see the engine nacelles being built for those nice twin Gilbert pipes to exit.
Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
That is an amazing looking airplane. !930's, looks like they hung a couple of turbo props on a ME 262 Swallow but it predates that. Predates turbo's too unless the one pictured is quite updated.
Kit bashing a C/L 262 kit to fit would be fun.....if you could find one that wasn't profile.
Gotta google that.
Bob
And gcb, thanks for that picture. Tongue muffler, neat.
Hijacked one of EWB's pictures. Are the R/L mufflers really that different?
Edit add: Googled Westland Whirlwind. Good old wikipedia, I should support them I check them about every day. I was interested in the engines...liquid cooled V12's the reason for the large narcilles.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westland_Whirlwind_(fighter)
Kit bashing a C/L 262 kit to fit would be fun.....if you could find one that wasn't profile.
Gotta google that.
Bob
And gcb, thanks for that picture. Tongue muffler, neat.
Hijacked one of EWB's pictures. Are the R/L mufflers really that different?
Edit add: Googled Westland Whirlwind. Good old wikipedia, I should support them I check them about every day. I was interested in the engines...liquid cooled V12's the reason for the large narcilles.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westland_Whirlwind_(fighter)
rsv1cox- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
Yes, left and right mufflers for the .11 are that much different. If you were to give right side thrust enough, both mufflers then will be level and evenly spaced on each side of the fuselage for an upright engine.
Engine you got is similar to the one I got from Steve earlier this year, except yours has additional items that since he ran out of (dacron thread, fuel tank, etc.). Those mufflers look functionally similar to the Tatone in-cowl muffler header. I received the same short prop thust plate hub, that leaves a gap between the plate and crankcase.
George (gcb)'s .074's has an interesting tongue like muffler, just two holes on each side of the muffler blank. If one had a milling machine, it would be easy to duplicate these mufflers. I'm almost thinking that if one had some K&S C channel aluminum or brass whose inside width was about the same outer width of the exhaust muffler flange area could fabricate a muffler that might work, although it wouldn't be as much of a chamber though.
Haven't checked to see how much the .11 muffler removes the bark, bench ran them without mufflers.
Engine you got is similar to the one I got from Steve earlier this year, except yours has additional items that since he ran out of (dacron thread, fuel tank, etc.). Those mufflers look functionally similar to the Tatone in-cowl muffler header. I received the same short prop thust plate hub, that leaves a gap between the plate and crankcase.
George (gcb)'s .074's has an interesting tongue like muffler, just two holes on each side of the muffler blank. If one had a milling machine, it would be easy to duplicate these mufflers. I'm almost thinking that if one had some K&S C channel aluminum or brass whose inside width was about the same outer width of the exhaust muffler flange area could fabricate a muffler that might work, although it wouldn't be as much of a chamber though.
Haven't checked to see how much the .11 muffler removes the bark, bench ran them without mufflers.
Last edited by GallopingGhostler on Sun Nov 30, 2014 7:12 pm; edited 1 time in total
GallopingGhostler- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
rsv1cox wrote:I was interested in the engines...liquid cooled V12's the reason for the large narcilles.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westland_Whirlwind_(fighter)
Actually, not all that different to the P-51 which used a Rolls Royce Merlin- still a supercharged liquid cooled V12. Peregrine was 21 Litres and the Merlin was 27 Litres.
(I started writing this before your edit )
Rod.
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
I read that the Westland Whirlwind fighter had teething problems with suitable engines, although otherwise it was a fine fighter. It remains a neat looking twin that would surely garner looks when brought out to the flying field. Powerwise, I find it interesting that the Gilbert .11 turns a 7x3, OS Max .10R/C and Fuji .099S-II turn a 7x5, and Enya .09-III turn a 7x6, relatively speaking. That helps me to better place the Gilbert .11's with the appropriate airframe.
GallopingGhostler- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
Oldenginerod wrote:rsv1cox wrote:I was interested in the engines...liquid cooled V12's the reason for the large narcilles.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westland_Whirlwind_(fighter)
Actually, not all that different to the P-51 which used a Rolls Royce Merlin- still a supercharged liquid cooled V12. Peregrine was 21 Litres and the Merlin was 27 Litres.
(I started writing this before your edit )
Rod.
Yes, I had second thoughts regarding the P-51 engine and deleted that referance.
Happy that I did. The P-51 was such a narrow and sleek airframe I thought the Whirlwinds engine must have had a lot more stuff hung on it. Senior moment.....
rsv1cox- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
Well here is my Gilbert 11 In ah action ! like to have gave up before it started as it was my last engine of the day to run had been all afternoon working on a couple others giving problems https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HFBLNnYFpbU Its no power house as ya 'll have said . You thing the 7x3 airscrew was too much for it ?? Eric
getback- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
Yes, sounds tempermental. Up, down all around. Perhaps a 6/3 or 4? Fuel type? I do like the remote positioned needle valve, but it could interfer with installation. Are you going to mount it on a plane?
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rsv1cox- Top Poster
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Re: Two Gilberts with mufflers
getback wrote:Well here is my Gilbert 11 In ah action ! like to have gave up before it started as it was my last engine of the day to run had been all afternoon working on a couple others giving problems
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HFBLNnYFpbU
Its no power house as ya 'll have said . You thing the 7x3 airscrew was too much for it ?? Eric
A 7x3 is the correct prop. 7,000 RPM is kind of low. My guess is that yours may be a little tight, require further run in for break in. I'd give it a chance. Once it loosens up, you should get better runs on it. I ran mine on 15%, they seem to love nitro.
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