Cox Engines Forum
You are not logged in! Please login or register.

Logged in members see NO ADVERTISEMENTS!


Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Cox_ba12





Log in

I forgot my password

Search
 
 

Display results as :
 


Rechercher Advanced Search

Cox Engine of The Month
January-2023
1/2A Nut's

"Tee Dee .020 RC"



PAST WINNERS
CEF Traveling Engine

Win This Engine!
Gallery


Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty
Live on Patrol


Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  sosam117 Sun Nov 27, 2022 1:54 am

I picked up some Enya mufflers (seven of them) a few months ago at a swap meet.
Got a good deal on them ($5.00 a piece)

All missing the screws/bolts for them.
Two mufflers (Enya 19X) missing the straps and hope either Bob Brooks has them or Ken Enya?

There is other straps included but don't belong with the Enya mufflers I have (maybe go to O.S. mufflers?)

One muffler (Enya 60-III) was really corroded (oxidized).
I was going to wire brush it the best I could then paint it.
A friend suggested I should try this Birchwood Casey Aluminum Black.
Like bluing for metal but for aluminum. So, I purchased a bottle to give it a try.

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Img_0171

My friend came over to give me a hand on how to use it.
He has used it to redo/cover up small scratches on his pistols.

So, I wire brushed off the bad oxidation on the muffler the best I could, then wiped the muffler with denatured alcohol as per instructions. Then using one of the cotton swabs you would use for gun bluing, I dipped it in to the Aluminum Black solution that I poured into a plastic cup.

As I swabbed the solution on, I think I saw "smoke" coming off the muffler?
As I swabbed more of the solution on things were not looking good?
The muffler surface looked like it was getting rougher, but it was turning black.
So. o.k. I got the entire muffler coated and waited a minute like the instructions said.
Then I rinsed the muffler to remove the Aluminum Black solution off and sprayed on some "gun oil" on the muffler as per instructions and left it for a day.

Next day, I looked over the muffler and felt it and it felt gritty?
Looked at my hand and it was black and gritty, land it felt like 180 grit sandpaper?
I wiped off the oil that was on the muffler and all of this black stuff was in the rag and the muffler felt really rough too?

What to do?
I decided to use some steel wool and scuff this gritty stuff off the muffler.
It worked but now I have a scratched up, smoothed, and lightly pitted muffler?

Well, I tried the Aluminum Black solution again. this time things went better. No slight smoke, everything turning black (nicely).
No real problems like the 1st time. Finished up doing the same as the 1st time with gun oil.

Next day took a look at the muffler. Had some light and dark spots. So, I figured to do it again and coat it one more time.
As usual, gun oil on it and came back the next day.

The muffler looked pretty good. Only downside was the slightly rougher finish that if the muffler was new.
I think that was caused by the corrosion that was originally on the muffler before I used the Aluminum Black?

Well, I decided to use a "clear" high temp clear paint (used for exhaust headers).
I just gave it a super light coat to just cove the surface to seal it.

The muffler looks good but if you see carefully in the photo, you can see how rough the surface is.

Next, I figured to try it on a slightly used Enya 19X muffler.
This muffler had no pitting, on slight discoloration (like the other Enya 19X muffler in the photo).

With this muffler, I used the Aluminum Black solution on it twice to get an even "black" finish o the muffler.
I did the same procedure as the Enya 60-III muffler, except it has no clear coat of paint on it as the finish turned out better on this muffler.

The un-blacken Enya 60-III was just wire brushed -- but not as oxidized as the one I blackened.


Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Img_0172



Well, what I have learned is that if there is a lot of corrosion on the muffler, using Aluminum Black solution might not be the answer.
If it is good clean aluminum, it might turn out not too bad?
sosam117
sosam117
Platinum Member
Platinum Member

Posts : 930
Join date : 2016-03-23
Location : Suburb of Chicago, Illinois

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  rsv1cox Sun Nov 27, 2022 3:02 am

Nice explaination.

I had not seen that product, must be formulated for aluminum instead of steel. The roughness is very apparent over the unfinished mufflers but it seems that you cleaned it properly beforehand. The product must be eating into the metal. Smoke.

Recoating works, often I will recoat my Oxpho treated metals at least three times before I'm happy.
rsv1cox
rsv1cox
Top Poster
Top Poster

2021 Supporter

2022 Supporter

2023 Supporter

Posts : 8851
Join date : 2014-08-19
Location : West Virginia

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  crankbndr Sun Nov 27, 2022 3:26 am

I have no luck with that stuff either, comes right off on aluminum.
crankbndr
crankbndr
Diamond Member
Diamond Member

Posts : 2956
Join date : 2011-12-11
Location : Homestead FL

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  sosam117 Sun Nov 27, 2022 7:56 am

crankbndr wrote:I have no luck with that stuff either, comes right off on aluminum.

I think the main problem with the big muffler was all of the corrosion that it had beforehand.
Which was probably aluminum oxide (and the reason it "smoked")

So, when I used the Birchwood Casey Aluminum Black it etched even farther past the corroded area?
Maybe that is why the surface got even rougher?
The rough stuff that came off was probably the small bits of aluminum that was corroded?

The "clean" newer Enya muffler (smaller) didn't have that problem (because of any corrosion?)
sosam117
sosam117
Platinum Member
Platinum Member

Posts : 930
Join date : 2016-03-23
Location : Suburb of Chicago, Illinois

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  rsv1cox Sun Nov 27, 2022 8:14 am

The smaller (upper) muffler looks the better of the two. Nice effect scuffing off the ENYA. Really sets it off.
rsv1cox
rsv1cox
Top Poster
Top Poster

2021 Supporter

2022 Supporter

2023 Supporter

Posts : 8851
Join date : 2014-08-19
Location : West Virginia

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  944_Jim Sun Nov 27, 2022 8:46 am

Too funny! I've been cleaning out my garage for the last two days. While sweeping under the Porsche, I noticed I hand-screwed all the aluminum lug nuts back on each hub (well, I noticed a while lot more than just lug nuts). These are a flat-black finish when new. Thirty-six years later they aren't so black anymore.

This is the very stuff that came up when I was searching earlier today.
Thanks Sosam!
944_Jim
944_Jim
Diamond Member
Diamond Member

2021 Supporter

2022 Supporter

2023 Supporter

Posts : 1673
Join date : 2017-02-09
Age : 57
Location : NE MS

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  Levent Suberk Sun Nov 27, 2022 9:14 am

I think that result depends of aluminum type.
avatar
Levent Suberk
Diamond Member
Diamond Member

Posts : 1849
Join date : 2017-12-25
Location : Türkiye

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  GallopingGhostler Sun Nov 27, 2022 9:42 am

Levent Suberk wrote:I think that result depends of aluminum type.
You may be onto something, Levent. The earlier muffler does appear to be of a slightly different aluminum.

7 years ago I did the antifreeze bath, clean-up, then used Mother's Mag and Aluminum Polish on this Enya .35-III TV engine and separately purchased muffler.
https://www.coxengineforum.com/t8180-a-few-tips-i-have-learned-on-restoring-the-19-to-40-red-blue-head-mccoy-engines#104094

Before:
Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Enya_210

After:
Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Enya3512

Although it's finish does not mirror an NOS one, it still looked quite acceptable after clean up. It does appear to be cast of a different aluminum alloy.

Perhaps the aluminum is porous enough that Castor and corrosion are easily embedded restricting complete removal, hindering the treatment to chemically bond evenly to the aluminum surface of the older muffler?
GallopingGhostler
GallopingGhostler
Top Poster
Top Poster

Posts : 3842
Join date : 2013-07-14
Age : 68
Location : Clovis, NM, USA

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  sosam117 Sun Nov 27, 2022 10:52 pm

Yes, maybe the older muffler didn't have as pure aluminum asthe newer muffler?
Maybe the old muffler has some magnesium in it and that would cause the "smoking".

Magnesium was a good, cheap, filler to aluminum.
I didn't think about that until I read your posting GallopingGhostler.

Like the old "original" Mills engines that were made in England.
Those had to be careful on storing them because after a while they would get a white powdery stuff on the crankcase.
That is why the Mills engines were painted black, to try to reduce the corrosion.
sosam117
sosam117
Platinum Member
Platinum Member

Posts : 930
Join date : 2016-03-23
Location : Suburb of Chicago, Illinois

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  getback Mon Nov 28, 2022 12:19 am

I think you have it figured out , and you know once the pitted metal is gone it is gone and all you can do is fill it in as best you can >> Is that Alum. bluing got a temperature range ? For heat of coarse . Babe Bee .049
getback
getback
Top Poster
Top Poster

2022 Supporter

2023 Supporter

Posts : 9300
Join date : 2013-01-18
Age : 65
Location : julian , NC

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  sosam117 Mon Nov 28, 2022 2:09 am

getback wrote:I think you have it figured out , and you know once the pitted metal is gone it is gone and all you can do is fill it in as best you can >> Is that Alum. bluing got a temperature range ? For heat of coarse . Babe Bee .049

It doesn't say anything about a temperature range?
It's two different acids that just discolors the aluminum.

Below are photos taken of the label:


Side Label:
Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Img_0174
Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Img_0175




Back Label:
Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Img_0173


Last edited by sosam117 on Mon Nov 28, 2022 2:12 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : spelling mistakes)
sosam117
sosam117
Platinum Member
Platinum Member

Posts : 930
Join date : 2016-03-23
Location : Suburb of Chicago, Illinois

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Enya muffler update --- important --- please read!

Post  sosam117 Wed Dec 14, 2022 8:25 am

A friend of mine (Rod Wolfe) came over to my house for a little work for me to do for him. (about a week ago.)

While he was there, I showed him the two mufflers hat I had and the problems I had with one of them.

As I talked to my friend (that works in a metallurgy lab) and talked to him about the problem I had with the larger Enya muffler compared to the smaller "new" version.

I told him when I used the Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black on the older (Enya M603 60 size) "larger" muffler that the muffler was "smoking" a little as I rubbed on the aluminum black, and it seemed that the muffler getting gritty?

Now on the smaller Enya 19X muffler.
The Aluminum Black darkened the muffler the way it was supposed to with no real problems, unlike the Enya M603 muffler.

Rod looked over the two mufflers that were blackened.

He asked "if" I had any original mufflers that were not blackened?
I asked what for?

He'll take them to work and see what the mufflers composition is.
Rod stopped by my house on his way home from work on Friday (09/12/22)

He told me that the "old" Enya M603 muffler had a mix of 68% aluminum, 23% zinc and 9% magnesium.
The smoking effect was the Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black acid reacting with the high amount of zinc in the muffler.
That cause the gritty "stuff" to show up on the muffler and farther pitting the surface.

The newer 19X muffler had only 6% zinc and 19% magnesium. and 75% aluminum.
So, Rod told me the best thing clean the muffler to where it looked almost new is to either sand blast it or wire brush it (gently).
He said I'll never get a supper shiny "chrome" finish in these mufflers because of their composition.

And he advised me "NOT" to use the Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black on any of those mufflers!
As the "smoke" coming off the muffler is toxic.
sosam117
sosam117
Platinum Member
Platinum Member

Posts : 930
Join date : 2016-03-23
Location : Suburb of Chicago, Illinois

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  GallopingGhostler Wed Dec 14, 2022 8:37 am

sosam117 wrote:He told me that the "old" Enya M603 muffler had a mix of 68% aluminum, 23% zinc and 9% magnesium. The smoking effect was the Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black acid reacting with the high amount of zinc in the muffler. That cause the gritty "stuff" to show up on the muffler and farther pitting the surface.

The newer 19X muffler had only 6% zinc and 19% magnesium. and 75% aluminum. So, Rod told me the best thing clean the muffler to where it looked almost new is to either sand blast it or wire brush it (gently). He said I'll never get a supper shiny "chrome" finish in these mufflers because of their composition.

And he advised me "NOT" to use the Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black on any of those mufflers! As the "smoke" coming off the muffler is toxic.
That is a good accurate assessment by your friend, sosam117. I got fairly close to a mirror finish with Mother's Mag and Aluminum Polish on the old muffler for my .35-III TV, better than the OEM. It is sort of dark, pearl-like. Of course if one wants as manufactured purity in finish, that will never do. But it was certainly an improvement, although not a museum quality (i.e., original) finish.
GallopingGhostler
GallopingGhostler
Top Poster
Top Poster

Posts : 3842
Join date : 2013-07-14
Age : 68
Location : Clovis, NM, USA

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  gkamysz Wed Dec 14, 2022 12:12 pm

Those are extremely odd alloys. So odd they don't seems to exist commercially or anything even remotely similar.
gkamysz
gkamysz
Gold Member
Gold Member

Posts : 282
Join date : 2018-02-23
Location : Chicagoland

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  GallopingGhostler Wed Dec 14, 2022 2:27 pm

gkamysz wrote:Those are extremely odd alloys. So odd they don't seems to exist commercially or anything even remotely similar.
Apparently was obsoleted by around the mid 1960's. Perhaps has to do with the equipment and molding techniques of the day, it was easier to cast, obsoleted by improvements by use of better forming equipment and machining / molding techniques, improvements in metallurgy. For example, my early 1950's French made Selmer Beaugnier Vito bari sax, was made of red brass (higher copper alloy content),

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Vito_b11
My Vito bari before clean-up, red shows it has high copper content.
Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black 2015-110
My Vito bari after clean-up, brass looks normal without corrosion.

in contrast to modern, harder brass used in forming brass musical instruments by machine today. (That tarnishes with more of a brown color than red - other alloy besides copper.) My sax was hand made, the metallurgy was easier to form and bend by hand tooling. (The factory closed its doors in 1970 as they using hand forming techniques could no longer compete against machine formed saxes.) In other words, no one does it this way these days.)  Smile

Nonetheless, it is kind of nice to own a little bit of unique Enya history.
Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Enya_310
Early Enya .29-.40 muffler as received.
Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Enya_311
Enya muffler on .35-III TV (above left).
Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Enya_312
Enya muffler on .35-III TV (left underside).

With a little more work, I believe using Mother's Mag and Aluminum Polish, I could obtain a mirror-like finish overall on it, not that it is really worth going to such an over-effort.
(There are no photo awards or prizes for Enya's on our Cox Engine Forums.) Lighting The Tree lol!
GallopingGhostler
GallopingGhostler
Top Poster
Top Poster

Posts : 3842
Join date : 2013-07-14
Age : 68
Location : Clovis, NM, USA

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  sosam117 Thu Dec 15, 2022 12:36 am

That is a nice-looking muffler (before) compared to some of the mufflers I originally started with.

Going to swap meets, you don't really find those nicer looking mufflers, but you find the ones with this "whitish" stuff on it.
Corrosion and pitting.
That is why I tried the blackening process on those "two" mufflers. (not no more!)

And they can be had for a cheaper price:

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Enya_190
Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Enya_191


This is a muffler that I "was" going to be blackened but I'll give it a good brushing with the steel (fine wire) brush.
And maybe, use a buffing wheel on it?

Wish I had a small bead blasting set-up? That would make it look as good as new?

Ken told me that years ago they use to tumble the parts in a vibrating tumbler with ceramic shaped media.
He sent me a photo of the media. Size is approximately 6mm dia. and a length of 15mm.

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Tumble10
sosam117
sosam117
Platinum Member
Platinum Member

Posts : 930
Join date : 2016-03-23
Location : Suburb of Chicago, Illinois

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  GallopingGhostler Thu Dec 15, 2022 5:58 am

Lacking bead or stone blasting materials and equipment, I use varying grades of steel wool, coarser for initial cleaning, then finer to polish out scratches. The soaped pads such as Brillo are nice initially as the soap helps to carry away the dust particles by soaking here and there with a clean water bath, similar to wet sanding. Fine brass bristled brushes help to clean up inside sharp crevices such as lettering. Then after going over with fine steel wool when muffler is dry. After, use Mother's.

Of course, I wasn't opting to restore any factory bead blasted finish, just improve what I had.

If there are gouges from say mishandling or crash damage, I carefully dress them with a fine file. It is amazing how surfaces clean up when the burrs are removed. I did that on my OS .40LA R/C prop thrust washer, looked like someone used pliers, cleaned it up to look quite acceptable.
GallopingGhostler
GallopingGhostler
Top Poster
Top Poster

Posts : 3842
Join date : 2013-07-14
Age : 68
Location : Clovis, NM, USA

Back to top Go down

Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black Empty Re: Tried and used Birchwood Casey -- Aluminum Black

Post  Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum