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Post  Yabby Thu Sep 02, 2021 9:44 pm

I am thinking about building a DR1 by Paul Plecan. https://outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=5041

The plans call for an Arden .099 . I believe the .099 is an older engine that used spark plug and ignition timing kit. Would the power output of a TD 049 be near to that of an Arden .099?

I have printed the plans out full size and its looking like a lot of plane for an 049 TD.

Thoughts appreciated.

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Post  FlipStart Thu Sep 02, 2021 10:26 pm

3 wings at 24" and a big body fuse. lots of drag there but the little TD is surprisingly strong. maybe it would work. Did COX make an .09? that might be perfect. A .15 would be too much I think, unless it's a real sturdy heavy plane.
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Post  Yabby Thu Sep 02, 2021 11:10 pm

Thanks Flipstart, I only fly 049 Cox engines. I find it easier that way. I have them setup so they work really well for me. Both surestart and TD 049 engines. I do have an OS Max LA 1.5 but its still in the box. Lol. I used to use Enya 2.5cc and Taipan 2.5cc Gold head glow race engines when I was young in combat wings. But I really enjoy my Cox engines.

I think you are right about the plane and its size etc. When I printed the full scale plans I thought thats a lot of plane even for a TD 049. I will look at building another of the Fokker WWI planes. Heaps of plans there for the different mono wing and Bipe Fokkers from WWI, and Im sure I can build one of them light enough for my Cox 049 Surestart or TD.

Thanks for your thoughts Thumbs Up cheers

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Post  Ken Cook Fri Sep 03, 2021 4:08 am

The power isn't as much of a issue, it's the weight. The DR-1 is close coupled and in order to balance it, your going to need lots of nose weight. The fact that most DR-1 especially scale or fun scale planes don't have symmetrical wings makes it a roundy round plane and not a stunter. All your doing is flying level and a occasional up and down maneuver. A engine like a Mccoy .098 is better suited for a plane that you show. It's turd like performance is perfect for flying in circles due to the fact it's almost 3 times as heavy as a TD.
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Post  Yabby Fri Sep 03, 2021 4:53 am

Thanks Ken, Lol. lol! cheers Thumbs Up
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Post  balogh Fri Sep 03, 2021 1:36 pm

@FlipStart wrote:3 wings at 24" and a big body fuse. lots of drag there but the little TD is surprisingly strong. maybe it would work. Did COX make an .09? that might be perfect. A .15 would be too much I think, unless it's a real sturdy heavy plane.

Yes COX made TeeDee 09 and Medallion 09 engines. I personally prefer the TeeDee because of its brute force and light weight. It sometime pops up on ebay in NIB condition and even COX International sells it somegime..

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Cox-ENGINE-Tee-Dee-09-1-5ccm-/124862817548?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l49286&mkrid=707-127634-2357-0
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Post  Yabby Fri Sep 03, 2021 5:09 pm

Thanks Balogh Thumbs Up cheers

The help from everyone is appreciated as now I havent started building a model my engines wont fly, or fly very well!

Im still laughing at Kens description of the "turd" Im going to slip that into a design meeting at work when I can lol! Its a very underutilised term. Especially in aerospace engineering, but conveys such disgust so well! lol!

I understand only using 049 engines restricts some model plane choices but all these things are compromises and I am happy to compromise the models I can build and fly for the simplicity of my flying time using the Cox 049 range of engines for which I have heaps of spares and find easy to run and maintain. I fly CL only and fly with my Lad and we are not club members for various reasons, so I dont get to fly combat anymore like when I was young. We have thought about flying combat together using stooges but consider it too risky in public parks without a third person to watch and warn and alert etc.!

The models I normally fly are great fun to fly with an 049 and their capability is much greater than my skill lol! So Im happy with my flying lot. cheers

There was a thread a while ago with an old Cox Dr-1 in it and that got me thinking again how much I like those old WWI planes. Even if they dont stunt overly well I would like one, and I always build from scratch or from plans. I have never owned a pre-built plane or build from kit. I am thinking I will build a different model or adapt a FF or Rubber model to CL, and if it doesnt work out great, I still will enjoy it and learn something, and my Lad can look forward to me crashing it after building it. lol! Very Happy Clapping

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Post  aspeed Fri Sep 03, 2021 6:02 pm

Can't say how much power the Arden has but can show a blurry picture of mine.  It had a broken case and it was brazed together into a big blob.  The guy said it ran good but I never tried.  It doesn't really look like a sparky to me.  likely glow.  It is at the other house so I can't see it, we are in the middle of a move again.  I would guess the power to be like a Queen Bee .074. maybe an LA .10 or .15 would be more power (fun) than needed.Power Comparison Contro13
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Post  rdw777 Fri Sep 03, 2021 6:10 pm

Something else you may think about if you really like the plane is shrink the plan to accommodate your engine…..Just make it more typical 1/2 A size based on wing area….You could also just use the outlines and build it profile….

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Post  Yabby Fri Sep 03, 2021 9:10 pm

The plans talk about having to locate the ignition module so I assumed the Arden they were referring to is a spark type engine, but I admit to no knowledge of those engines :-) The good thing is I didnt start building it, as everyone seems to think the 049 is too small, and I am glad I posted and checked what people thought before building.

I have thought about scaling the plans! Might be a good job for one of the Graduates at work. Lol. No, that would be very wrong of me. Huh... lol!

I have found a FF plan and a Rubber plan for a DR-1 with 12 inch wing span. I reckon I will beef it up to be somewhat stronger and see how I go. I reckon it will work. Even if it rips apart in the air or on landing, so be it. cheers

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Post  Yabby Fri Sep 03, 2021 9:35 pm

Just scaled it up by 25% in Adobe which makes 14 inch wingspan. Might go up a bit more yet. Then I can use Adobe to measure points on the plan and annotate directly onto the plan and print the scaled up plan in poster mode and scaled up.

Yep. This is going to work out.Very Happy

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Post  aspeed Sat Sep 04, 2021 9:01 am

I checked on a "Yahoo" search, and the Arden .099 used gas until Arden accidentally invented the glow plug. He used it on the .099 but it was built with ball bearings to take the extra load. That would have been around 1948 or so. When I was a kid I made a Guillows Spad with a 24" span. It was pretty light and went very slow on control line with a sputtering Babe Bee. My buddy could almost keep up with it on his ten speed bicycle. I then put a TD in it and it was a totally different animal. I triplane would maybe require a bit more power than a biplane but it did go quite well. I still have that plane but it needs a rudder. Maybe some day.
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