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World of Aviation

SIG Hummer

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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  Mark Boesen on Sat Oct 19, 2013 9:19 pm

nice link, THANKS!
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  ian1954 on Sun Oct 20, 2013 6:36 am

Phil, Mark and Roddie

Thank you for your replies - this is what this forum is all about. We have a time difference - so I had a lot to take in this morning but my responses are in progress.

Feel free to berate or admonish!

Ian
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  ian1954 on Sun Oct 20, 2013 7:49 am

quote="roddie"]Is the wing spar mat'l. "as per plan"... or did you choose to use a stronger wood? (just curious)

I watched a guy "wring-out" an Ace "All-Star Bipe" with a .40 on it... He was an accomplished 3-D flyer, and at launch; the plane R.O.G. in about 20 ft. and went straight-up like a rocket! It was flying very well... "unlimited vertical"... spins... barrel-rolls... inside/outside loops... until both wings folded. Everyone at the field gasped as it tumbled to the ground. He probably would have had his hands full attempting to land, if he'd gotten the chance. It was a small field with tall trees around the perimeter. He would have had to approach final "hot"... and there simply wasn't enough runway for that. "S.T.O." rather than "S.T.O.L.".... It "did" have foam wings... and I can't remember if he reinforced them or not. Probably not, as he had built and flown it with the recommended .10/.15 engine size previously.

I know you'd never intentionally risk a model in this way... This was just a memory of my witnessing what happened to a "ridiculously" over-powered plane.[/quote]
Roddie,

Your reply, together with Phil and Mark's, would indicate in the politest possible way that the motor I selected is way over specced and would turn the Hummer into a rocket!

Also what was not said directly is "You would have to be suffering from lunacy or a nutcase to stick that motor in the Hummer!" or "This is a recipe for disaster!".

Joking apart, I still have difficulty getting to grips with the size of the Hummer - How does a little Cox engine take a plane of that size to 80+ mph? 1/2 A?



The Hummer has been built from a kit. I have only modded the rudder - all spars are as supplied. They are very hard balsa - particularly the leading edge.



This was (is) a quality kit but I would probably be the first to admit that the model is perhaps not suitable as a slow park flyer!

This is where I fly - this particular morning I chose the smaller field - the larger field next to it was shrouded in mist. If you perservere or skip through the video, you will see a much larger area as the mist clears. These fields get very busy during the day and so I take the opportunity to go first thing in the morning and join the dog walkers!

[

This is literally 2 or 3 minutes walk from my home.
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  ian1954 on Sun Oct 20, 2013 8:19 am

Mark and Phil,

The motacalc software looks good but it still doesn't answer my question on the disparity in calculation of motor size between CL an RC. Maybe that should be another topic!

However, I have just got off the phone with the chap that recommended the motor. My so called expert friend - he who deserves a slap!

I said "That motor is probably three times too powerful for the Hummer, what made you recommend it?"

He said "I measured it and it fits!"



Anyway, I looked at the link that Mark posted and the 1400 kv recommendation of Phil - rummaged in my box of bits - many boxes and many bits!

I have a Turnigy D2822/14 1450KV - it doesn't fit but luckily I haven't covered that area yet! I will have to remove some wood.

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__12916__D2822_14_Brushless_Outrunner_1450kv.html



Do you think this will be OK? - I have 2s and 3s batteries - 7 and 8 inch props!
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  roddie on Sun Oct 20, 2013 11:26 am

Hi Ian, It's good that you're re-examining the elec. power options for the Hummer. I am just learning about elec. powered flight... so unlike Phil and Mark; I can't make any accurate "technical" recommendations there... but if I were to build an elec. powered Hummer... I'd try to come close to the weight and thrust of the recommended glow engine and fuel tank size for the model. Let's say that Sig recommends a Cox Tee-Dee .049/.051 with a 6 x 3 prop and 1 ounce fuel tank... I would "weigh-up" a full fuel tank with engine, and shoot for "as close to that weight as possible" for an elec. motor/battery combination. If your closest elec. combo is a little "heavier"... the battery(s) can always be moved rearward to balance the plane, and unlike a fuel tank; battery weight doesn't change, between a charged to discharged state.

I'm with "Phil" on prop-savers...  It would be nice if brushless motors could be "stepped"... to "park/brake" the prop in a  "horizontal" position for landing. That would be a nice feature.

Roddie
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  pkrankow on Sun Oct 20, 2013 3:59 pm

I get it, it fits so...

I ran into this on a Ringmaster Jr. I am electrifying. I got called on it too. I was told similar stuff. For most performance matching thrust or prop size and RPM are more reliable than watt output. I ordered a .10 equivalent motor...it can swing prop and produce thrust like a .40.

I am figuring I have the airframe, suitable batteries, so why not?

Don't carve on the nose, plan to install blocking. Electric drive lines typically weigh less than glow fuel drive lines after all is accounted for. This means that the plane will become tail heavy and require ballast.

Glow fuel weighs approximately 75% of water, FWIW.

Phil
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  ian1954 on Sun Oct 27, 2013 6:15 am

pkrankow wrote:I get it, it fits so...

I ran into this on a Ringmaster Jr. I am electrifying.  I got called on it too.  I was told similar stuff.  For most performance matching thrust or prop size and RPM are more reliable than watt output.  I ordered a .10 equivalent motor...it can swing prop and produce thrust like a .40.

I am figuring I have the airframe, suitable batteries, so why not?  

Don't carve on the nose, plan to install blocking.  Electric drive lines typically weigh less than glow fuel drive lines after all is accounted for.  This means that the plane will become tail heavy and require ballast.

Glow fuel weighs approximately 75% of water, FWIW.

Phil
I am seriously considering ( 3 seconds past) - done. Considered! I will be going for full sized electric control line. I would like to see your progress.

The Hummer is now finished

Balanced



Rudder modification



Posing with little brother

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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  roddie on Sun Oct 27, 2013 11:40 am

The Hummer Looks great Ian! Looks like it balanced-out real well! In that photo; is that a hearth for coal-fired fireplace/stove, that I see in the background? Looks like a coffee pot sitting on the hearth... and a brass hammered-finish coal bin on the left? I love that stuff! There's nothing like a nice "roastie-toastie" workshop in the Winter!
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  Mark Boesen on Sun Oct 27, 2013 9:32 pm

Plane looks great, but i didn't see any baseball diamonds in video?

Remember to put something on the plane so you can tell rightside up at distance.
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  ian1954 on Mon Oct 28, 2013 2:47 pm

Baseball Diamonds?

Is this some way of seeing orientation and telling top from bottom and front from back?

I am in no hurry to fly at the moment. It is very, very wet and very, very windy!
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  Mark Boesen on Mon Oct 28, 2013 5:28 pm

Hi Ian,

Sorry poor attempt at humor, I was commenting on the fact that there was no baseball diamonds only soccer fields...

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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  ian1954 on Mon Oct 28, 2013 5:50 pm

Mark Boesen wrote:Hi Ian,

Sorry poor attempt at humor, I was commenting on the fact that there was no baseball diamonds only soccer fields...

You mean football pitches!

The goal posts make useful markers and help me judge distance. My eyesight is not good and I have lost a third of the sight in my right eye. You will see this from how I have to change my stance.

I am also on the flight path to Heathrow - I have to be careful not to think I am piloting the wrong plane! If you can stand it - 4 minutes into the video you will see one on final approach.



Seriously though - if anyone has any tips on marking a plane to make it easy to see the orientation - it would be appreciated.

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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  Mark Boesen on Mon Oct 28, 2013 8:54 pm



Since the design is late Seventies/early eighties, small and fast, why not go with something like the old pattern ships of that era?

The designs and colors were as much for visual orientation as for snazzy!


http://www.trentonrcflyers.com/pattern/pattern1.htm

p.s.
Rusty might think differently, but this is a football 'field'





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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  pkrankow on Mon Oct 28, 2013 9:36 pm

Black and white stripes on the bottom of the wings are surprisingly visible. They need to be bold, say 1/2 to 1 inch wide. The color scheme becomes surprisingly invisible at 100+ ft.

If you have aileron control, you twitch a slight roll. If it rolls the direction you are controlling you are flying AWAY from your position. If it is OPPOSITE the control input you are flying TOWARDS your position.

With rudder control if you put a slight steady turn in and the control is in the indicated direction, you are flying AWAY from your position. If it is OPPOSITE the control input you are flying TOWARDS your position.

(up vs down for inverted/upright should be obvious)

Rudder control works for rescuing a speck on the horizon. A little steady turn, see what direction it moves and keep turning gently until it is flying directly back to your position.

Phil
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  Mark Boesen on Mon Oct 28, 2013 10:01 pm

pkrankow wrote:
Rudder control work for rescuing a speck on the horizon.  A little steady turn, see what direction it moves and keep turning gently until it is flying directly back to your position.  

Phil
lol, been there, rudder or aileron, slowly! It's amazing how far they could go...and how long it takes for them to get back.

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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  Mark Boesen on Mon Oct 28, 2013 10:20 pm

pkrankow wrote:
Rudder control work for rescuing a speck on the horizon.  A little steady turn, see what direction it moves and keep turning gently until it is flying directly back to your position.  

Phil
lol, been there, rudder or aileron, slowly! It's amazing how far they could go...and how long it takes for them to get back.

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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  ian1954 on Tue Oct 29, 2013 9:23 am

Mark Boesen wrote:
pkrankow wrote:
Rudder control work for rescuing a speck on the horizon.  A little steady turn, see what direction it moves and keep turning gently until it is flying directly back to your position.  

Phil
lol, been there, rudder or aileron, slowly! It's amazing how far they could go...and how long it takes for them to get back.

Thanks for the advice chaps. I have just ordered some "Solartrim". I hope it sticks on "Lightex"
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  Mark Boesen on Fri Nov 01, 2013 4:31 pm

I've had pretty good luck with window cleaner, after you cut your rays, spray  'windex' type cleaner on wing, position, use finger to lightly push out bubbles and excessive cleaner, let dry, use low heat around edges... I just reread post, if its peal-n-stick forget the iron!
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  ian1954 on Fri Nov 01, 2013 5:27 pm

Mark Boesen wrote:I've had pretty good luck with window cleaner, after you cut your rays, spray  'windex' type cleaner on wing, position, use finger to lightly push out bubbles and excessive cleaner, let dry, use low heat around edges... I just reread post, if its peal-n-stick forget the iron!

I just searched Windex - It is a clear liquid ammonia based window cleaner. The nearest thing we have to that is Windowlene but that is creamy. Most of our liquid window cleaners are vinegar based.

Is Windex common in America. I am in Chicago next week.
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  JPvelo on Fri Nov 01, 2013 7:03 pm

ian1954 wrote:
Mark Boesen wrote:I've had pretty good luck with window cleaner, after you cut your rays, spray  'windex' type cleaner on wing, position, use finger to lightly push out bubbles and excessive cleaner, let dry, use low heat around edges... I just reread post, if its peal-n-stick forget the iron!
I just searched Windex - It is a clear liquid ammonia based window cleaner. The nearest thing we have to that is Windowlene but that is creamy. Most of our liquid window cleaners are vinegar based.

Is Windex common in America. I am in Chicago next week.
Windex is probably the most popular window cleaner in the states, you can find it anywhere. Make sure to get the original blue formula with ammonia d.
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  ian1954 on Sat Nov 09, 2013 11:32 am

I finally got a bottle of "Windex" but it was confiscated at the airport. I was advised not to try and carry it through security so I donated it to the young lady at the check in desk.

I would have been OK if it had been under 100ml but I got a big bottle.
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  Francois on Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:50 am

I dig up this post!
I search plan to build Hummer for my TeeDee. I just find it on the SIG site. But the shipping charges are $23.45 for France!!! Plans cost 3.90$. Huh...
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  Tee Bee on Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:34 am

Your Hummer looks nice.

I plan to start building one soon. Right now, I'm thinking I'll power it with a Medallion .09 and leave it as a 2 channel. Looking forward to it.
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  OVERLORD on Fri Dec 01, 2017 4:46 pm

Bonsoir François,

Here you can find the plan in PDF:

https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=28169323&postcount=2

You just have to find a way to blow it up.

Lieven
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Re: SIG Hummer

Post  NEW222 on Sat Dec 02, 2017 2:08 am

Why do you have to blow it up? How about a tiled version you can print at home? Letter size, or A4? Just send me a PM with your email address, and paper size you prefer, and I can send you a copy. Smile Not sure how to attach a .pdf here.
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Re: SIG Hummer

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