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Post  mccoyboy Sat Mar 20, 2021 3:41 am

I have been putting together an Ace+ C/L trainer to use for my first foray back into C/L after around 47 years.
The kit is a really great intro to electric C/L as everything is supplied in one package. Excellent wood quality and the whole thing can be easily built in a weekend.

Ace+ c/l trainer. Ace_ki10

Parts going together:
Ace+ c/l trainer. Ace_pa10


Last edited by mccoyboy on Sat Mar 20, 2021 3:49 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : pictures not arranged properly.)
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Post  mccoyboy Sat Mar 20, 2021 3:47 am

I haven't worked out the posting of pics and my two pics seem to have almost merged...I notice it looks like two kits and two building boards in my first Post!
The kit has a clever undercarriage arrangement and the supplied O rings provide suspension for those heavy landings!

Ace+ c/l trainer. Ace_un10

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Post  mccoyboy Sat Mar 20, 2021 4:08 am

The instructions suggest that the finish be kept light with the minimum of trim. Most images show a sealed bare wood finish with some decals made from tissue.
I had planned to cover in tissue but decided that as I have an unopened bottle of Delux Materials 'Sand n Seal' I would give it a go.
I painted on both sides of the 1/8th wings and stab/elevators and then placed them on kitchen film wrap and put a weight on top to help prevent warps.  
An hour later and the items were dry so I gave them a light sand with 800 grade paper to bring back the silky smooth finish. Then the process was repeated.

Question: how do I know I have used enough sealer? The wings were 35 grams and after two coats of sealer they are now at 39 grams.

Ace+ c/l trainer. Ace_tr10


Last edited by mccoyboy on Sat Mar 20, 2021 4:11 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Picture added.)
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Post  getback Sat Mar 20, 2021 7:36 am

Two is usually what i would go with , what is the OAW they suggest ? Plane is looking Good !! Popcorn
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Post  mccoyboy Sat Mar 20, 2021 8:22 am

Hi getback,

I have weighed the airframe and all components and it is around 150grams without the 'fuel tank' and 'fuel' (2s lipo battery). With lipo installed and ready to take off, it should be around 185-200grams.
No weight is mentioned in the instructions, just to keep it light.

It being electric, I only need to seal against the weather/damp grass. When I last did some doping many, many years ago, the balsa would become darker with the dope but this does not really happen with the 'Sand n seal'.
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Post  getback Sat Mar 20, 2021 9:29 am

I would leave it at the 6-7 Oz.mark is were you will bee ,, i read up on the sealand sand and other products tring to see if it was fiel proof (( cause when i first looked at the post it did not show all of it // then went back and realized it was to bee Elect. Rolling Eyes A Lot of good stuff here .. https://www.greathobbies.com/manuals/d/dxm/dxmbd42_product_broucher.pdf Old Bugger Was your Dope old that U used and turned to browning ? i have not seen this or maybe the type , i know i got Aero products over 10 yrs. old and they work fine .
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Post  mccoyboy Sat Mar 20, 2021 9:45 am

Thanks getback,

I started to attach the cloth hinges using Superphatic glue which is like a thin cyano and wicks into the wood. I noticed that the glue around the edges did not wick into the wood as fast as usual and so the wood appears to be sealed with the two coats of 'Sand n Seal'. The Superphatic worked well on the hinges and 20 minutes later a good set has been achieved.
I will keep the trim down to a just a canopy for now.
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Post  mccoyboy Sun Mar 21, 2021 2:22 pm

Well after the 'TO DO' list was complete, I got back into the hobby room and finished the Ace+. Den recommends 500 - 800 ma lipos and so I ordered one of each size to try. When they arrive I can check the C of g and then velcro the electronics in place.
Then it's fingers crossed for the weather and the maiden when we are out of lockdown. Weight of airframe as is = 145grams/ 5 ounces. With the 500 ma lipo it will be 184grams /6.4 ounces and with the 800ma it will be 200grams/7 ounces.
Main objective is just to get a feel for flying c/l again. It would be nice to get a loop out of it though!

Ace+ c/l trainer. Ace_aw10

Ace+ c/l trainer. Ace_al10


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Post  dirk gently Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:40 am

Ah, the old EMAX 2805. I'm still flying those, I think I have one that's more than 10 years old, still going strong Smile
With a 2s battery it's close to a good Baby Bee in terms of performance.
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Post  mccoyboy Mon Mar 22, 2021 6:13 am

@dirk gently wrote:Ah, the old EMAX 2805. I'm still flying those, I think I have one that's more than 10 years old, still going strong Smile
With a 2s battery it's close to a good Baby Bee in terms of performance.

Hi dirk gently,

It is good to know the motor is a good one...assuming I don't hit the dirt too much! If it survives, and I survive going around in circles with the Ace+ then I may try it in a Keil Kraft Radian?
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Post  getback Mon Mar 22, 2021 10:23 am

Cool The Keil Kraft Radian looks like a fun model , hope you decide onit for a build (thread) Very Happy
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Post  mccoyboy Mon Mar 22, 2021 10:49 am

Hi getback,
If I do build one I will certainly do a thread so you and others can see how it goes together (or help me put it together!).

It is a model I recall from my childhood and I have a nostalgia thing going on at the moment.

I will see how things go with the Ace+.

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Post  Coxfledgling Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:33 pm

I have an untouched kk radian kit in my loft...been resisting temptation until I can get stuff photocopied, I also have an untouched kk demon, and an untouched Cox cosmic wind I think it is....
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Post  mccoyboy Tue Mar 23, 2021 3:16 am

Hi coxfledgling,

Wish my loft had such goodies!

With the price of balsa these days, a kit or two in storage is a treasure.

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Post  mccoyboy Tue Mar 30, 2021 3:40 am

Hi all,
Well, I am glad to write that after 47 years away from C/L I have flown the Ace+ twice this morning.


This morning was forecast light winds and so I knew I had to seize the moment and set of to my flying site but mist was forecast for much of the day. The local park was my fall back option (the advantage of electric) and early in the morning there was only a few dog walkers in the distance. Unfortunately it was very misty; not a problem with 28 feet of lines but the ground was very wet. The air was dead calm though.

The instructions state to reduce the power to 80% and use 20 feet of lines. I am awaiting some braided fishing line but used the supplied Dacron line today. Given what I had read regarding the Ace, I decided to fly using the full reel of Dacron ending up with a  line length of 28 feet from handle to wing tip. I left the power at full to compensate.

I had already been through the starting procedure several times and programmed the timer to give a thirty second flight. This I thought would be long enough to get a feel of the airframe but short enough to help with the dizzies. There is the option to set the timer as low as 10 seconds which could be useful for someone not knowing what to expect or when trying an airframe for the first time.

Everything went smoothly and the Ace leapt into the air and climbed sharply as a result of too much elevator being held in to stop a nose over. In a split second I had given a quick flick of the wrist to bring it back to level and the Ace settled.
In this moment I understood it was true that 'you don't forget to fly control line' although a whole load of practice will definitely help!

Well, the Ace was responsive but stable throughout. It was moving at a good pace though and I would not want it turning any faster ( I estimate 3.5 seconds per lap). The motor 'burped to signal the end of the run' and I ensured the Ace was at a good height and then 5 seconds later the motor cut, and she glided down and without much input settled on the grass for a nice landing.
I felt the dizzies hit but by standing still for just 4-5 seconds they passed. I was really grateful that I read the suggestion to 'dry fly' and I had built up to a couple of minutes (although at 4-4.5 seconds per lap) as I feel sure this is why the dizzies passed so quickly  and I was ready for the second flight.

The second flight went equally well but I noticed the need to hold some down in with the wrist. The landing was good again (down to the good manners of the Ace) but I found myself automatically stepping back a bit, giving a slight whip of the lines before touch down and a tad of elevator (all an instinctive response arising from somewhere in the past. Good and bad habits will no doubt appear)
I have checked over the lines but nothing is loose and so I think it was either the fact that I moved the lipo slightly back or the up line had become wet and was pulling on the elevator? The plane was quite wet at this point and so decided to quit while all was good.
The Ace is definitely a good training option and reminds me of my first flights with my KK Champ so many years ago. Still thinking an 0.49 on a model would complete the nostalgia trip though.
Can't wait to get out again and continue my journey back to control line.
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Post  getback Tue Mar 30, 2021 6:53 am

cheers cheers cheers cheers Clapping Clapping Clapping What a good feeling to get out and have that fun you miss from all those years sunny Moving the Lipo back would change the CG so that is probably what the second run with down elve. to keep her level was. <> Did you leave it full power for the 2nd. run also ? I can't tell from the pics. does your outer wing panel support a counter weight ?
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Post  Coxfledgling Tue Mar 30, 2021 7:24 am

So glad for you !

A champ with a DC sabre ? That's what I flew to socks off as well. I bought on from a forum to make templates from so will have another one for ever ! I even have a sabre for it too.

It's a real summer's day here in Snowdonia with not a hint of a breeze even, and we are allowed out to play, but I have to grasp the weather to fix the pug, only 3 more suspect wires to replace in the window ngine loom to ECU, where I think the intermitant problem lies, and my back is killing me with all the under bonnet stooping. It hurts.

Enjoy...

I might be able to sneak in a helo flight this evening, ninja 250...wish me luck.

Have you seen the £4 chuck gliders in Lidl, just about big enough to squeeze radio gear in for a slope soarer, and maybe electric powered...
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Post  mccoyboy Tue Mar 30, 2021 10:52 am

Hi getback - thanks for the support, a big part of the fun is being able to share on this forum with those who understand. I think my R/C flying buddies think I have gone mad!
I used the supplied tip weight for the wing tip. I did not feel any pull but it showed no signs of coming into the circle and was responsive throughout. Next time I will fly with the lipo in the same position as first flight and and I have rechecked the lines and handle and set again to ensure all is well. I left it at full power for the second run as I had no way of knowing how much I was altering it at the field. Later and at home I checked the Tacho reading and it was showing 15400 rpm on the supplied 6x3 prop. The instructions recommend 80% throttle with 20 feet lines to start with. The timer has a potentiometer that you adjust with a screwdriver and I found it tricky to set but managed to turn it down to 14000 rpm which sounded like a noticeable difference and as I was on 28 feet lines I decided to leave at that for the next flight?
Hi Coxfledgling - I feel your pain; Snowdonia in the sun and unable to get out flying, but 'good luck' and enjoy your evening flying session if you manage to get out.
The sun came out later in the morning and so I went out to fly my little XK 800 glider which glides remarkably well for what it is. I purchased it thinking I would use the R/C for putting into a Keil Kraft Invader or Caprice or similar but I am not sure the r/c installation would work out. Still the little glider has been great fun as is and can handle a bit of wind. I would say the Lidl glider at £4 has got to be worth a go!
KK Champ powered by a McCoy 0.49.
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Post  dirk gently Tue Mar 30, 2021 3:03 pm

Cool, looking very mean and purposeful!
What's the wingspan?
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Post  NEW222 Tue Mar 30, 2021 6:29 pm

Congratulations to you for your re-entry into the hobby, and successful flights. You also did a great job on the plane. I like to see a beautiful model built up and finished with just the 'naked' wood showing!
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Post  mccoyboy Wed Mar 31, 2021 3:00 am

dirk gently, Thanks - it is 23" wingspan.

NEW222, Thanks - The 'naked wood' was to keep the weight low but it reminded me in flight of my KK Champ that was the same but with a bit of painted trim to follow the scheme on the box lid.
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Post  mccoyboy Wed Mar 31, 2021 10:47 am

Another 5 flights today. The reduction in revs ( to about 90%) made all the difference and I am getting 4 second laps which felt about right. Starting to enjoy the feel of it and there was a bit of a breeze today to add a new dimension. The Ace handled it no problems and the undercarriage worked well on less than perfect ground. C of g felt good but may be a little move back when it comes to aerobatics later.

The instructions state that an APC 5.5 x 4.5 should be used for aerobatic flying and so I am guessing the bigger pitch will give faster flying. I will try 35 feet of Spectre lines and full power before attempting a loop.

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