Tee Dee 010 self destruction?

roddie wrote:[

Hi Andras! I'd say that you've come up with a good solution; one that would be simple for other people to duplicate, using only an aluminum can... and scissors to cut it into the deflector shape. It's lightweight.. and providing those tabs that sandwich securely in-between the firewall, makes it a "1-piece" add-on that doesn't require any hardware.

I doubt that you'll have any further melting of the tank-plastic, due to the aluminum "sinking-off" the heat and dispersing it over a much larger area. If your "tabs" are long enough, it would allow you to raise the rear-section slightly to increase the air-gap.. if it becomes necessary.

Thanks Roddie yes, my solutions in general are not really complex and rewarding for those who seek extended efforts to remedy problems in a more professional way, but chances are this will work too...

Levent Suberk wrote:A piece of heat reflective tape can be another solution other than heat deflector.

https://www.amazon.com/Design-Engineering-010408-Self-Adhesive-Reflective/dp/B000E283S0#immersive-view_1674411935461

Levent, this is great.
Do you think that hot castor will not dilute its backside glue and make it peel off the tank?

Andras, I think that it needs to replace at every flight run. Need to try.

https://www.designengineering.com/content/faq/010408.pdf

From FAQ pdf:
"Cool-Tape has a super strong self-adhesive backing capable of protecting up to 2000°F radiant heat. It is made of a one mil aluminized material bonded to woven fiberglass"

Sounds excellent, Levent..would be good to have a piece and try...our favorite lubricant, castor, does not seem to have unsurmountable hurdles when it comes to seeping into places no-one wants it to seep into

Andras, if you have another .010 then try to change cylinder. Perhaps exhaust slots will be parallelled with crankshaft in this way.

balogh wrote:Sounds excellent, Levent..would be good to have a piece and try...our favorite lubricant, castor,  does not seem to have unsurmountable hurdles when it comes  to seeping into places no-one wants it to seep into

Yes, this one seems a very simple solution.

Yes I have quite a few waiting for their turn, so swapping the engine may also be a quick way..but that would be a severe sentencing of this engine, that is supposed to work in any random exhaust position, as it was intended to by its producers..I will try my best to find it a chance for its continued service.

balogh wrote:Yes I have quite a few wsitng for their turn, so swapping the engine may also be a quick way..but that would be a severe sentencing of this engine, that is supposed to work in any random exhaust position..I will try my best to find it a chance for its continued service.

Right

I have seen comments that the exhaust port pointing front to back give the best performance. Removing the the exhaust faster is my guess. It would be a shame to have to move the cylinder down (sand the case) or up (shim) The first solution with the shim stock coming from the back is good. Maybe the aluminum duct tape would be something to try if you have some around the house. There should be a gap between the plastic, and the glue may not stick for long either. Too bad, the tanks/backplates should really be made from aluminum, not plastic. They would not vibrate as much and give better performance as well.

davidll1984 wrote:

Levent Suberk wrote:I am going to make one:

Yes very good ider may not forget that a shim is used at the rear in this way it is dangerous for the crankshaf and the connecting rod the connecting rod could come out of the track inside the crankcase what you add on one side must be removed from the other i bad expérience this trouble using one made for .049 bee engine The crankcase must be adjusted the right way is to remove the cylinder measure then after adding this part the crankcase will have to be adjusted to have the same measurement

This is a red herring and not worth worrying about for a moment-the shim sits in place of the tank gasket and should have a central hole that matches the ID of the crankcase-there is NO WAY it can have the slightest effect on the crankshaft or rod. Levent's idea is quite practical-and allows you to adjust the angle of the deflector so you don't contact the tank top forward portion. In addition-with a bit of experimentation in the angle you can also -by using a compound angle-arrange for the exhaust to be deflected off most of the model to one side or the other.

FWIW-I had a similar experience some 35 years ago bench running a G-Mark 03 engine without the muffler-the top front edge of the tank started to melt....fortunately I noticed before too much harm had been done-and made up a deflector very much along the lines of Levent's design-but with 3 screw holes to match the roughly triangular G-Mark crankcase external rear profile.

On the material used by mecoa I am inclined to agree that it is different from the original used by Cox-though I disaggree that te original stuff was Delrin....which is not usually moulded...being generally only supplied as solid rod and plate [I have used it for decades...] and normally only in either natural cream or black.

ChrisM
'ffkiwi'

I think that your small heat shield for the fuel tank is a great idea. It solves the problem. It is bad luck when the exhaust port faces to the rear like that. What the guys say about using a gasket for a shim to reclock the exhaust ports more to the sides is a good idea too. Cox usually had the engines already set with the exhaust angled to the sides. I don't remember seeing one with the exhaust facing forward and aft before. But I suppose stuff happens though.

im surprised no one has asked, but I will

Which beer?

you cut a can, which beer?
this may make a difference in speed, agility, etc.

Earlwb you don't see the cyl. port frnt. to back that often , I and some people believe the engine runs stronger with induction of prop forces air into in ?!?!?   And for beer this is what I would use but i am not in Hungary >>

Well, any good draft beer that comes in cans! Bud Light or Miller Light are obviously included!
The one I repurposed for heat shield is Dreher :

Are you sure, András, cstatman and Eric?

I say, Near Beer (casi cerveza, majdnem sör) This is after all, a family oriented forum.



Wow András, I have never seen such heat damage to an engine tank. I thought that the plastic was Delrin, but my .020 Tee Dee had the tank back recessed center mount hole break off, releasing the back after 26 years of storage after last run. Cox must have used a different plastic. I bought my Tee Dee 40 years ago.

Regarding exhaust port orientation, all the Cox .020's I still have, the 2 Pee Wee's and 1 Tee Dee have the cylinder exhaust ports oriented exact like András' .010 Tee Dee cylinder, front and back.



My .020 Tee Dee hasn't shown signs of tank heat deterioration.



It hasn't been run as much as my Pee Wee (metal tank protected) or my R/C Bee, but similarly, the exhaust of the R/C Bee when used without silicon muffler cover is sufficiently above the top of its plastic tank.

Fading and marking is superficial. After taking the photo, I rubbed my thumb over top the .020 Tee Dee tank. No heat damage, it is dusty and the dust with fade came off just by rubbing. With some elbow grease plus cleanup of the engine, can be restored to OEM look. The smaller .010 is 79% the size of the .020. That places the tank closer to the exhaust.

Seems you have isolated the problem to only the .010's.

Best small Tee Dee solution was the very nice, machined extended capacity aluminum tanks Bernie @Cox International was selling a couple years ago. (I bought one for my .020 Tee Dee. ) Those won't melt. However, I think the sheet heat shield idea similar to the Cox .049 manufactured one, which diffuses and deflects the exhaust may be the more permanent solution.

If push came to shove, both Bernie and Mat @EXModelEngines still have the non-tank plastic back for external tank use. In that case, I think the .010 aluminum back by Kamtechnik would be the best if one wanted a totally heat resistant mount (without tank, of course.)


https://kamtechnik.com/product/ktk-01/ Back Plate Mount Cox Tee Dee .010

But, I know that what I have said, András already knows, being very experienced in this matter. It's extremely winding today (gusts to 55 mph - 90 kmh), please don't mind me boring you with my droning.

Poster left in the cabin on our property by the previous owner. I thought it clever so I left it up. Physical education and Australian culture especially.

Thanks, Bob and George, and all, keeping this thread alive.

I believe the exhaust port orientation parallel with the crankshaft may have been intentionally set by COX in the early days, at least it is like that in many of my old-stock reedies, Tee-Dees and the like dating back to the 60-s (primarily thin wall cylinders of these engines are the indicators of the age here)..even the instruction sheets of the engines show the engines with such orientation.

Because such orientation is only possible with the controlled tapping and cutting of the threads on the cylinder and crankcase, COX may have given up this orientation in an effort to cut production cost, and the random port orientation that followed may or may not have an impact on the engine performance.

Strictly saying, apart from this 010 with the Mecoa replacement tank, I also experienced the - stock - plastic backplate melting on one of my active TeeDee020-s, where I have doctored the problem with the same aluminum deflection plate....the brand of the beer whose can skin was repurposed for the deflector  may have been different, but the solution worked there, too..

Well that s funny out of 5 .010 and .020 engines i just looked at not one is straight front to back cly. port orientated !! there close but not enough to burn the tank ,