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Flying lines and length Empty Flying lines and length

Post  Greenman38633 Sat Feb 24, 2024 8:00 am

Hello again. I have acquired some pylon brand .015 seven strand stainless wires. I am wondering for Cox control lines are these useful or are they too heavy ? As you all know the closer you are to your model plane the faster you are going to go around in a circle the more dizzy you will get. At 63 years of age I am concerned about this. That’s why I am going to start practicing spinning around in a circle. Adding to the number of spins a little each day
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Post  Greenman38633 Sat Feb 24, 2024 8:05 am

So therefore it seems to me that I need the longest control lines I can get and still function. I saw a YouTube video the other night of a 049 flying with success using 52 foot lines. He said they were a little slack but it still works. He said he was using spidersilk. Apparently some type of braided 30 pound test fishing line. On the other hand I have many roles of the Cox supplied control lines. Using two roles I could get out to 42 feet or more. What suggestions can you guys give me. Thanks
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Post  Ken Cook Sat Feb 24, 2024 10:32 am

Your question can not be successfully answered without many factors your left out. First, why are you trying to fly on lines that long in which these planes were not designed to fly on? What plane are you flying on that length? What does it weigh? What exact engine is in the plane? What propeller are you using? If speed is the issue, going out on longer lines could possibly cause a wreck. There's too much drag on that amount of additional line and weight of the lines themselves if your flying Cox ready to fly models. So even if it does fly, it won't get up to the proper flying speed which means that the outboard wing tip could possibly be tip high with the inboard flying low. This is usually a immediate recipe for a crash.

The APC 6x2 is a horrid prop for flying Cox powered planes, it might just suit your needs as it will do nothing more than beat air. You could also take your propeller and turn it around backwards which would be a simple test. This makes the propeller very inefficient. The plane will have little to no drive but it will get it airborne. It will put the rpm's up very high but the plane won't fly fast. Cox also made a 6x2 which is not a tractor prop and uses reverse pitch to assist in torque to the outboard tip. It offers very low drive as well which would keep the speed down. Keep in mind though that when the rpm's go up, the fuel economy goes down.
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Post  rsv1cox Sat Feb 24, 2024 12:43 pm

Ken makes good points. Forget half A. Find a balsa biplane .25 - .35 powered and fly that on 52' lines. Lot's of drag and slow with lots of lift. Once your into it again, graduate up to the speed stuff.
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Post  roddie Sat Feb 24, 2024 2:02 pm

Hi Mark, As Ken mentions; we need a little more info. on the model that you intend to fly. Most of the Cox RTF (ready to fly-plastic) models won't fly well with lines that are longer than 30 feet. Most of these plastic RTF models are also NOT aerobatic.. so you're limited to level-flight with some slight climbs and dives. The smaller Cox RTF Pee Wee .020 powered models require even shorter lines.

The Cox-supplied Dacron line is fine for the models it was supplied with. The .015" 7-stand stainless in my opinion; is heavier than what's normally needed for a 1/2A class model. The aforementioned 30lb. "Spider-Wire" (Dyneema braid) fishing-line is also heavier than what's normally needed for a 1/2A class model. The 15lb. Dyneema braid is plenty strong.. and what many people use for their 1/2A models.

Regarding the dizziness associated with flying U-Control model airplanes; there are some tricks that can help. Do NOT focus on the model in flight. Instead; focus on a few individual segments of your flight-circle's background ahead of the model's flight-path.. which the model fly's through. This is how figure skaters and ballet dancers can "spin" without getting dizzy. When the background is blurred and moving (similar to certain carnival rides).. it causes vertigo/spacial-disorientation leading to dizziness. A circle is 360 degrees.. so you could try picking 3 points at approximately 120 degrees apart to be your 3 focal-points. You'll still "see" what the model is doing... well enough to control it.

I hope that this helps you with making some decisions.

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Post  Greenman38633 Sat Feb 24, 2024 2:27 pm

Amazing.  Thanks Roddie for all that good information.  Very helpful
 The 15 lb dyneema braid , for 1/2a planes , what is the advantage of using this line over the Cox supplied line ?   Is it lighter , less sag ?
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Post  roddie Sat Feb 24, 2024 2:59 pm

Greenman38633 wrote:Amazing.  Thanks Roddie for all that good information.  Very helpful
 The 15 lb dyneema braid , for 1/2a planes , what is the advantage of using this line over the Cox supplied line ?   Is it lighter , less sag ?

Yes and Yes.. The Dacron (Cox type) is more "draggy". The Dyneema braid is less "stretchy".. giving more positive control-feedback.. as well as faster response to control-inputs. The Dyneema requires the use of a 5-turn/uni-knot wherever there's a termination. This is very important as well as being an AMA requirement when using that type of line.

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Post  Greenman38633 Sat Feb 24, 2024 3:57 pm

Awesome
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Post  706jim Sat Feb 24, 2024 3:58 pm

52' lines. To me that is amusing. We used to fly our 1/2A airplanes on 8' lines, just because we flew in my cousin's front yard and it was REALLY small. Not much stunting possible with those short lines. We were able to make"sabre dance" airplanes with cardboard wings and meccano parts (with the engine mount bent outwards and upwards) that would come to a stop mid air and then resume flight with down elevator input. So long ago.....
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Post  Ken Cook Sun Feb 25, 2024 8:07 am

I don't believe it's possible to discover any difference between Spider wire or Dacron. 1/2A planes don't offer enough pull to differentiate one from the other. Phil Cartier of Corehouse is mainly responsible for the use of this type of line offering his tested inputs to the AMA. So the reason it's used it because one the Spider wire and other types are sold in bulk and colors allowing one to see it on the ground such as hi vis yellow. Many of us on the east coast documented line breaks, types of knots, stretch tests, break tests, etc. All this information was gathered and sent to the AMA. It was rejected time and time again.The main reason we wanted to use this style of line is because it's not harmed when walked on when the planes are confined in the pit area. The other real main reason is that when we fly combat and you get into a line tangle, the steel lines get curly Q'd and kinked. Therefore, your pissing away a set of lines every time this happens which begins to get quite expensive.


The submission for use in stunt was denied over and over again even though the combat guys were using them extensively for years. Finally, the hardheads caved in and authorized them for sport use. Even today, those that participate in contest flying can't use Spectra/Spiderwire for contest use unless approved by the CD. Therefore, one is flying at his or hers own risk. The use of these lines are approved for sport use only. The gray area is where it states in the AMA guidelines that as long as the equipment passes the required pull test it's a go.

All of this is meaningless to the everyday flyer. However, one isn't going to gain any greater performance using one over the other in flying standard Cox equipment. The Dacron eventually becomes oil soaked creating stickiness and substantial drag in the lines and Spectra/Spiderwire eventually does the same. If you want to improve actual feel and responsiveness, flying with .008" stainless lines can't be beat. However, if you even kink this style line, wrap it onto the reel and cause the slightest kink in it, it will break eventually. I personally fly with .012" on all my 1/2A Cox and Norvel equipment. The durability of .012 vs .008 is amazingly superior not too mention, one can hardly tell the difference between the two.
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