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Post  layback209 Sun Jul 21, 2019 2:11 pm

Thanks Ken, it does. Turns tight, has a nice steady run. I'd say its fully aerobatic. 8s, inverted loops, overhead 8s.... and most exciting it can take some wind!

Unfortunately I had a line issue on the maiden flight which caused me to pat the ground pretty hard, neutral some how shifted on me. Started a diagonal crack from the top of my doubler all the way down to where the tail edge is. Didnt end my day I just slapped some packing tap on and kept going. I think some glue injections should stiffen it up nicely. Now epoxy, wood glue or CA... hmmm

Also survived a nose dive when it went dead stick at the top of a loop and I didn't run fast enough. My fault again, I really should get a timer so I know when I'm about out of fuel.

Jim, maybe think about extending the doublers 1/2" past the tail. I dont think you need to run them as tall as I did. Also think about scraping the kit fuse and make one from laminating two pieces of 1/8" thk balsa with fiberglass in the middle. That would be awesome. I'm going to do that on the next 1/2 profile I build. Apparently I need the little extra strength with how I seem to operate lol.

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Post  layback209 Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:39 pm

Here it is prior to maiden flight.
Starting out with a 5x3 and muffler pressure. 25% 1/2a fuel.
Been a while since I doped anything, definitely made the error of of clear coat first then color. O well seems to have hardened nicely. It looks mean!

Probably be a good idea to add a skid wire. engine hangs out a bit, I fly over pretty long grass so it might be ok we will see.

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Post  944_Jim Wed Aug 28, 2019 6:57 am

Wow! That is stunning. Eagerly awaiting flight report.
Where is the balance point/CG?
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Post  getback Wed Aug 28, 2019 7:21 am

That is Nice!! What engine did you decide on , can't tell from the pics.
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Post  layback209 Wed Aug 28, 2019 10:41 am

Thanks, the cg is at 7/8". The engine is a norvel 0.061 AME. Lil satan build, cant decide on a power plant - Page 4 20190812
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Post  getback Wed Aug 28, 2019 11:17 am

Thanks , that should carry the mail really good !! Very Happy
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Post  layback209 Sat Oct 05, 2019 12:39 am

Maiden flight is done! Wow is this thing fun. Real point and shoot kinda characteristics, awesome flys like a lazer.

I had some issues with the norvel, behaved as if it was not broken in, just would not rev up... so I stripped it down and yup tight top end fit. Should of trusted my instincts, some times they are spot on.

So I dropped a teedee in that I new ran well. Wasn't able to get the tune quite dialed it, got cut short after the first flight as 2 of the engine mount bolts disappeared and the engine was sort of flapping in the breeze. I can tell this is going to be a fun model. Cant wait to find some more time to keep tinkering with it. Hope to shoot a video once I get it running properly. The teedee was close just needed to be richer.

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Post  944_Jim Sat Oct 05, 2019 1:52 am

Good for you! Congrats on the maiden run. That is always exciting!

Don't give up on the Norvel yet. And don't do anything drastic either (woops, too late). I have a pair of .074s that just about broke me of Norvels in general. They both almost hated to start when they were new...as in "I can't believe I spent too much to buy brand-new from NVEngines" new. In the red and white box-with papers-and warranty-and new smell. Really new! I fought them both on the bench for probably 10 run cycles at an ounce per run. They were still stiff at TDC.They slobbered their grey piston/cylinder coating for a while. But then they stopped the grey slobber, loosened up at TDC a bit, and really became real sweeties!

Now once broken in, they are some smooth, easy starting engines. You can't buy them from me... ever! I even bought up a bunch of extras in different sizes.

Make or buy a bench engine mount and run it off the plane for a few tanks. Instructions for proper break-in can be found here (pg 3) or at StuntHanger.

The TeeDee may do well to have the venturi sleeved. I don't know if I read it here or on StuntHanger, but one of the Cox regulars shows a small piece of brass thin-wall taking the venturi diameter down a bit. This would be a recent post within the last few months, and will improve fuel draw (richer) to make the engine behave more like a Medallion. Or you could slip a Medallion venturi/front cover (whatever that part or body-bit is called) in place with little effort. Either option makes the engine run without fuel pressure reliably.


Last edited by 944_Jim on Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:03 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post  getback Sat Oct 05, 2019 7:42 am

Hey Jim what fuel blend did you break in with? i just got i think 4 more of difft. sizes ( but it was the o20 TD that i was after Very Happy This Site Rocks!
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Post  Mike1484 Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:48 am

Love my Norvel Big Mig .06 . Took a while to break in but it is worth the time . Put it on a test stand , heat the top cylinder up with a heat gun before starting . The Norvel likes small props . Nice looking Satin . They are a bit small but fly good .

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Post  944_Jim Sat Oct 05, 2019 2:23 pm

Eric,
I used a homebrew.mix that works out roughly to 24%N/11%Synth/%9 castor.

Look for "fuel calculator" here or SH. I posted my mix, and the Excel spreadsheet that takes two known fuels and castor to generate percent values on all of it. I know I posted the link to the spreadsheet on SH about a month ago for Motorman...but don't think I gave my fuel values.

I can go out to the garage and check...the bottles are labelled with the quantities and resultant values if you want.
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Post  layback209 Sat Oct 05, 2019 11:27 pm

Thanks for the advice, that's really interesting about the teedee. I'll have to read up on it for sure.  The teedee sure does go but man is it tough to dial in.  Runs kinda ruff on the ground then when launched smooths out and screams, tough to figure out the needle setting with the variation between between the air and being held.  

I rolled the dice on the Norvel, I thought man i should really bench run this first (I picked it up used off a nice rc guy). But time constraints prevented it. I was suprised to discover that it wasn't broken in.

I'll be sure to use the heat gun, worked great breaking in rc car engines. Those power plants have insane tolerances.
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Post  944_Jim Sun Oct 06, 2019 12:39 pm

Get back/Eric:

See here:
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=39473399&postcount=18

I can email you the altered spreadsheet for 8 oz blends. PM your email for it.
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Post  layback209 Wed Jan 01, 2020 10:47 pm

First attempt at hand making lettering. I like how it turned out. I think next time I'll need to make it bigger its difficult to cut the small radis with a knife.

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Post  Cribbs74 Thu Jan 02, 2020 9:35 am

That thing is going to scoot!
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Post  Mike1484 Fri Jan 03, 2020 11:26 am

The lettering dressed the plane up real nice . Now get out and fly that bugger .

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Post  layback209 Mon Dec 19, 2022 7:38 pm

Not sure if I ever posted a flight video of this build in action and dialed in. Here it is, boy is it fun, gotta fly one mistake high 😆.

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Post  layback209 Mon Dec 19, 2022 7:45 pm

After a pilot error which resulted in patting the ground while inverted the model came appart one could say.

I've mostly got it back together, gave me an excuse to remove the tank. Bummer about the needle valve, I new I should of put a wire hoop in to protect it. Oh well, on a hunt for one of those. The engine is near new still, maybe 1l through it.

Can't decide if I want to make it a shelf queen or keep flying it... nah gotta fly it till it's dust Small Cox Logo I Love This Forum!

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Post  Ken Cook Mon Dec 19, 2022 8:33 pm

Did the needle valve spraybar bend or just the wire extension. You need to be careful there because the leverage the needle provides usually breaks the crankcase. NV engines is about the only source for a new one aside from buying a used engine. This is a direct contact, Klondike17@juno.com. His name is Alex and you can ask him for what your in search of, a picture will certainly help. In addition, if that doesn't pan out, you can use a Cox spraybar from a product engine and a piece of 5/32" brass tubing. Cut a piece of tubing the width of the case, file a hole through the center of the tubing and insert the Cox spraybar into the tubing. The hole in the spraybar should line up with the break through hole you made with the file. Solder the spraybar into the brass and then place the assembly into the case and this can be attached to the case with epoxy or JB weld. Alcohol will thin and clean up any residual epoxy or JB weld.

The balsa boom can be a bit weak and you can either make them from bass or make them from 1/16" ply and glue balsa skins to both sides and shape them, this will add much more strength.
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Post  layback209 Mon Dec 19, 2022 8:54 pm

Thanks Ken, awesome advice, appreciate sharing his contact info.  Yes unfortunately the spray bar and needle bent, can't turn it either.  I think the only reason the case didn't break was the spring contacted the cylinder and stopped it from bending further.

Wow great suggestion on a Cox spray bar, thank you, thank you. I have enough cracked horse shoe back ends to scab off of for this.  

I see no way to save it with out damaging it further.  Thanks for the contact info.  I did buy a few norvels off of Scott on here but never thought to ask him for some needle assemblies. Doh.


Last edited by layback209 on Mon Dec 19, 2022 10:38 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Post  HalfaDave Mon Dec 19, 2022 9:55 pm

Hi layback,
Wow,
My TDs would bog down in those lazy 8's...
Amazing !
I have no luck with those short tailed combat planes. Where is your CG ?
It could be my pilot error... but they all have been 'twitchy as hell' for me...
I have no Needle valves to help. Sorry,
Take care,
Have fun,
Dave
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Post  andrew Mon Dec 19, 2022 10:01 pm

That's a tough break with the bent needle.  Unless you need the length, I have always cut the wire extension off, then filed a notch in the knurled end for reference.  Reduces the chance of bending the needle and stops it from vibrating at certain RPMs.

After a couple of buzzed knuckles, you'll learn to keep your fingers back. Shocked
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Post  layback209 Mon Dec 19, 2022 11:08 pm

HalfaDave wrote:Hi layback,
Wow,
My TDs would bog down in those lazy 8's...
Amazing !
I have no luck with those short tailed combat planes. Where is your CG ?
It could be my pilot error... but they all have been 'twitchy as hell' for me...
I have no Needle valves to help. Sorry,
Take care,
Have fun,
Dave

Thanks Dave, I set the c.g. at 7/8" from the leading edge. I think running a streamer would add a bit of drag and take the twitchyness out of it as well. Ken mentioned that earlier in the thread, i carry some with me on the maiden, but didn't need it. This flew like a lazer, where ever you point it went.  

My teedee also wasn't well behaved on this model, I think I needed to add more head shims to drop the compression.  I use a little latex fuel bladder held in a fabric bag on top of the wing. It really gives consistent fuel delivery. Based it off of Rusty's lil Satan. Definitely miss his presence on here Sad RIP.

Thanks Andrew, that's exactly how I have my 1/2a zero set up, yup took a few bites out of me.  But dang she's hard/stiff to adjust, the spring set up is so good on these engines. I liked it stock in this case for quickly adjusting while cranking up using a bladder as I'm kinda fumbly with that whole set up.  But the downside is all that leverage... the was a nice gent local to me that offered his rc cab. I'll give it a go wired open and see how it does.
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Post  Ken Cook Tue Dec 20, 2022 3:09 am

I've also used the drill press with a indicator to find the high spot and have bent it back. I would say my success rate in doing so has been at about a 80% success rate in doing so. I would screw the needle until it couldn't move and then indicate it. It's very difficult not to put a Z in it so to speak but with the needle inside the spraybar, it usually bends back on itself.
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Post  getback Tue Dec 20, 2022 7:18 am

nice fling there , the TD was screaming love that noise when it puts all it got into making you happy .. I must have missed the crash ? if in the video Rudolph I have not tried the lazy 8 s but need to explore because going round and round makes me fall down at the end most the time Santa Smile Don't have a Lil Satan but do have a couple Combat Kittens that are OLD Huh... This Site Rocks! Flying
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