Cox Engines Forum
You are not logged in! Please login or register! Guests are limited to posting in the "General Questions (Guest Posting Allowed)" section only. Becoming a member is fast, easy and FREE!


Old Enya Show And Tell.... Babe_b10
Log in

I forgot my password

Search
 
 

Display results as :
 


Rechercher Advanced Search

Cox Engine of The Month
July-2019
Mike1484's

"Tee Dee .020 on a free-flight model"



PAST WINNERS
Speed Contest 2019
CEF Traveling Engine

Win This Engine!
The Traveling Prop
Gallery


Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty
World of Aviation

Old Enya Show And Tell....

Go down

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty Old Enya Show And Tell....

Post  NEW222 on Fri Mar 15, 2019 5:12 pm

Hi all. So yes, this happened. I did not say anything when I bought it, as I wanted to make sure it arrived before saying anything. And today it arrived. This is an older Enya .15 engine model 3303. Overall, it is a little rough around the edges, and needs a good cleaning. I wanted to take it apart for an antifreeze bath and all screws were loosened to see if they will come out in bothe the head and the front of the crankcase. All except for one! It was actually the first one I looked at on the head before I tried to loosen them. So I saved that one for the end. Well, I am typing this and it is still right where it was befor typing..... Someone had previously tried to loosen it as it looked stripped. I tried a bunch of screwdriver bits to loosen it with no luck. This also included using my torch to heat the area around it up to where I could not touch it. I guess due to teh way it is stripped, I could not get a good grip on the little bugger! So, it now looks like i will be cleaning it with the head still attached. I normally do not have a problem doing it assembled, however, when looking in the exhaust port, the liner does not appear to be in the correct orientation, not bad, but just a little off of being centered. If anyone would happen to have any ideas as to how to remove this 'devil screw', I am open to any and all suggestions. That is also if the liner is not a big problem being off center a tiny bit. I will assume that it has been run in the past like this, but it is just personally bothering me.
Old Enya Show And Tell.... 54515810
Old Enya Show And Tell.... 53921510
Old Enya Show And Tell.... 54371110
NEW222
NEW222
Diamond Member
Diamond Member

Posts : 2197
Join date : 2011-08-13
Age : 40
Location : oakbank, mb

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty Re: Old Enya Show And Tell....

Post  Oldenginerod on Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:48 pm

In the worst case, you could carefully drill the head off the screw, remove the head and then grip the stub of the screw in the vise.  I've done this a couple of times (never on an Enya) and it worked fine.  

First off, I would use a solid screwdriver bit and give the head of the screw a sharp tap.  This can jar the screw loose, but may also help to seat the screwdriver better to help undo it.  Don't set the engine on a solid surface though.  The screw needs to take the impact, not the crankcase.  Two person job.  One to hold the engine and the other to tap the screwdriver (unless you have three hands Laughing )
Oldenginerod
Oldenginerod
Diamond Member
Diamond Member

Posts : 2572
Join date : 2012-06-15
Age : 56
Location : Victoria, Australia

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty Update!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post  NEW222 on Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:54 pm

So the engine is now in the ol' Crock Pot having a nice hot antifreeze bath. And the best is it is now apart. I got the screw out. I would tell you how, but that is a secret..... Nah, just kidding. So I tried again to remove it using different screwdrivers with yet no luck. So I was a bit displeased, to say it kindly, and I just removed the front crank housing from the crankcase. I was going to put it in with the head attached. Then I thought I would remove the head bolts I could just so I could get my toothbrush in better as much as possible. After I did that, I saw that the head was lifting like a wedge from the side opposite of the screw. I thought isn't this odd. So as I knew that the phillips would not work I grabbed a small flat pocket screwdriver I had here. Put it in what remained of the screw head, and to my surprise, it undid with just two fingers and no force. So I was very happy. I wired it all together, popped it in, and came here to tell about it! So in a few hours it should be good enough for a brushing and oiling. then a final reassembly until being run. However, while apart, I looked at the cylinder and decided that it looked like it had never been moved so I will just leave it where it is despite it is turned approximately 1/16" more to one side over the other. I am assuming it ran before so I think it will run again, only cleaner looking! I am glad to give it a bath overall as it was very dirty inside and a bit cruddy. Now to just Google what size screws it will take and then get some and replace them all.
NEW222
NEW222
Diamond Member
Diamond Member

Posts : 2197
Join date : 2011-08-13
Age : 40
Location : oakbank, mb

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty Re: Old Enya Show And Tell....

Post  GallopingGhostler on Fri Mar 15, 2019 8:44 pm

To prevent tearing up the screw heads excessively requires the right screwdriver set. The screw heads are J.I.S. (Japan Industry Standard), which are a little different than Phillips. $14 total including shipping to US.

https://smile.amazon.com/Bessel-Vessel-Difference-Screwdrivers-No-220w-3/dp/B00E55DL4I/

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Vessel10

I bought a set of these and it makes a huge difference in both terms of grip and easing removal without damaging the screw's cross tip head.

Mother's Mag and Aluminum Polish cleaned up my discoloured Enya .09-III TV similar to your .15-III.

Before:
Old Enya Show And Tell.... Enya0910

After:
Old Enya Show And Tell.... Dscn2410
GallopingGhostler
GallopingGhostler
Diamond Member
Diamond Member

Posts : 2123
Join date : 2013-07-13
Age : 65
Location : Clovis, New Mexico

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty Re: Old Enya Show And Tell....

Post  Ken Cook on Fri Mar 15, 2019 9:37 pm

I keep a good stash of Enya parts on hand. I went through my screw packs and found something a bit interesting. The one package shows that the .09 and the .15III uses the same screw set 3mm x 7mm. Another package shows the .15 III using a 3mm x 8 mm. One thing I have also noted is that not all Enya's use a case gasket for the front portion of the case. I wonder if the additional length was due to some of the cases using a gasket.

Ken Cook
Ken Cook
Top Poster
Top Poster

Posts : 3541
Join date : 2012-03-27
Location : pennsylvania

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty Re: Old Enya Show And Tell....

Post  NEW222 on Fri Mar 15, 2019 11:54 pm

Well, it is out of the pot, and all back together. I gave it a little scrub to rid it of anything on the outside, and a quick brush. I then brought it back inside and gave it a very hot water bath. From the sink to the shop it went to undergo a hot air treatment to now rid it of the water followed by a light oiling of parts before re-assembly. While assembling it, I was still worried about that one screw. Then I thought I would switch the 4 screws from the case to the head, and the original head screws to the crankcase as they were the same size and length. At least I do not have to worry about removing the one problem screw anymore as I used it on the bottom of the crankcase and is accessible by pliers should I need to remove it again. The only other question I have is the following. Is there a head gasket on this engine between the head and the cylinder? If so, this engine did not have one. By the looks of it, even if it did have one, it was missing for a while. If there was one, where would one find one? Or could I use a piece of tin tape (I read this somewhere online before).

I am looking into a screwdrive as pictured, however, it was too late for this one anyway as the damage was already done. Also to note, Ken, this particular engine does indeed have a gasket between the front and rear of the crankcase halfs. As for the screw length, the cylinder is drilled right through, so did they possibly just use whatever they received or had on hand for length, as either 7mm or 8mm would work on the head assembly.
NEW222
NEW222
Diamond Member
Diamond Member

Posts : 2197
Join date : 2011-08-13
Age : 40
Location : oakbank, mb

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty Re: Old Enya Show And Tell....

Post  Oldenginerod on Sat Mar 16, 2019 4:58 am

I've had a number of .09s apart but not a .15. Definitely never found a head gasket in an .09-III or IV. I usually just use some lapping paste between the top edge of the sleeve and the head, giving the head a good twist back & forth. Clean it up and it seems to seal just fine. Any fine leaks should seal up with castor varnish with use.
Oldenginerod
Oldenginerod
Diamond Member
Diamond Member

Posts : 2572
Join date : 2012-06-15
Age : 56
Location : Victoria, Australia

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty Re: Old Enya Show And Tell....

Post  Ken Cook on Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:33 am

I wasn't making reference to a head gasket but rather the front housing gasket. Seeing that all the screws were the same in the engine, I just figured they offered a slightly longer length due to the engine having one. As Chancey mentions, his engine doesn't have this case gasket, I have 4 that do and one that doesn't. They just weren't always used on some versions and I have found this to be true with larger displacements as well.
Ken Cook
Ken Cook
Top Poster
Top Poster

Posts : 3541
Join date : 2012-03-27
Location : pennsylvania

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty Re: Old Enya Show And Tell....

Post  GallopingGhostler on Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:46 am

I don't recall seeing a head gasket on my .09-III's and .15-III's. According to the Enya engine manual that came with my .35-V TV, those have a 7.5:1 compression ratio, so there wouldn't be a need to gasket. My small OS's OTOH do have, but they have a higher compression ratio.

I've got a couple .15-III TV's, the R/C version, a very decent and reasonably powerful engine. They develop their peak HP with higher pitched or greater diameter props due to their lower peak RPM's compared with sport Schneurles. I was able to maintain the same lap speeds in wet-2 cycle using a Masters 8x6 prop as I was with an OS Max .15FP-S (the venturi version) using a Masters 8x4 on my Ringmaster Jr. It was able crack from wet-2 to lean-2 when manoeuvring stunts, then return to wet-2 in level flight.

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Ringjr10

Propped right, the Enya .09-III and .015-III are sufficiently powerful engines able to keep up with the plain bearing sport Schneurles, IMO. Prop them as if they were Schneurles with lower pitched or smaller diameter props will be disappointing, indeed. With a 7x3 prop on the .09-III TV, my old venerable Hobby Shack (Sure Flite) 40 in. Cessna 180 foamie flew very .049 like, but really moved out with a 7x6 prop, making it a fun aircraft. (Originally it was designed to use a Cox .049 tanked reedie.)

Enya .09-III TV, older T/F white nylon prop only for display:
Old Enya Show And Tell.... Dscn2710

Aircraft in flight (earlier fitted with a Norvel .061 Big Mig, don't have flight photo with Enya .09-III TV):
Old Enya Show And Tell.... Cessna10
GallopingGhostler
GallopingGhostler
Diamond Member
Diamond Member

Posts : 2123
Join date : 2013-07-13
Age : 65
Location : Clovis, New Mexico

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty Re: Old Enya Show And Tell....

Post  rsv1cox on Sat Mar 16, 2019 8:09 am

I enjoyed your narrative Chancey, and congratulations on that Enya .15

I haven't seen a modern Enya without a case gasket or one with a head gasket.  Some sand casts had case gaskets (6 bolts) some didn't.

There are several ways to clean them which I have explained here many times so I won't plow old ground.  

Pictured is just one way I use to remove the cylinder.  Just heat with a heat gun and use the piston to force the cylinder up and out of the case.  The piston catches the trash on top of the cylinder pushing it out.  Then do your boil.  Just note the way it comes out as you can install it 180 out with the intake and exhaust ports opposite.

Just one of 75-100 of these I have done.  

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Enya_122
Old Enya Show And Tell.... Enya_123
Old Enya Show And Tell.... Enya_124
Old Enya Show And Tell.... Enya_127
Old Enya Show And Tell.... Enya_125


Bob
rsv1cox
rsv1cox
Top Poster
Top Poster

Posts : 4274
Join date : 2014-08-18
Location : West Virginia

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty Re: Old Enya Show And Tell....

Post  NEW222 on Sat Mar 16, 2019 9:27 am

Thank you all for the help and advice given. Now to just wait for the weather to lighten up so I can get this thing, along with a few others outside and run in. As well, hopefully pick up a propeller in teh next couple of weeks too. I am thinking of 8 x 4 for bench running and also possibly to use on my Ringmaster Jr. My last trip to the LHS I bought me a 7 x 4 as that was what I heard that the Fox .15 engine liked. Now I also have to see which one of these two, Enya .15 or Fox .15x, will be installed on my Ringmaster Jr....... Off to go measure the mounting dimensions to see if they are swappable.
NEW222
NEW222
Diamond Member
Diamond Member

Posts : 2197
Join date : 2011-08-13
Age : 40
Location : oakbank, mb

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty Re: Old Enya Show And Tell....

Post  GallopingGhostler on Sat Mar 16, 2019 10:20 am

Downside to the Enya .15-III is its weight of 5 oz. (less silencer) for the Ringmaster Jr. The Fox .15-X weighs 3.6 oz. The OS Max .15FP-S (venturi version) weighs the same as the Enya .15-III. I put about 1.25 oz. weight on the tail to put the centerline where recommended, but then had the barbell effect in flight, flew heavy.

If you're sport flying or using the Ringmaster Jr. as a trainer, the Enya will do okay, but this plane with its 200 sq. in. area is not optimal for its (or the FP's) weight. I'm not an expert on this (we used to call an ex-spurt a former drip under pressure Laughing ) but think a Cl plane with around 300 sq. in. area might be better for the Enya (and FP). Some say that the OS Max .10 SR, FP or LA Schneurle less silencer (about the same weight as the Fox) is optimal. St.Pats Beers

With the Enya .15-III on a Masters 8x6 prop you can fly the Ring Jr. on 60 foot lines. It will do 4.5 second laps. (I fly at 4,300 ft - 1,311 m elevation, 12.4 versus 14.7 PSIA at sea level, which may account for the slightly faster lap speeds; 15% Byron Wildcat with a pint of Castor to up oil to 25% with 10% as Castor.)
GallopingGhostler
GallopingGhostler
Diamond Member
Diamond Member

Posts : 2123
Join date : 2013-07-13
Age : 65
Location : Clovis, New Mexico

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty Re: Old Enya Show And Tell....

Post  NEW222 on Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:47 pm

Well just another update. So I found out that the case of the Enya .15 is bigger than that of the Fox .15x. So with that said, and the fuselage already built, the Fox .15 got itself fitted up for testing of balance. I am definately glad I went with the Fox as it is lighter and this thing is not even covered yet. Looking like I will need to add some tail weight. Also I am just deciding on landing gear arrangement. The plans indicate a couple of plastic retainers to hold it in place, but I am thinking of doing it in the same way as my Lil' Jumpin' Bean. Shock absorbing with rubber band. I do not have clips on hand, but dowel I do...... The main reason I like teh shock absorbing style though is that I will be flying it on rougher ground, and this will be my first bigger plane so landings will probably not be very graceful!
Old Enya Show And Tell.... 54402610
NEW222
NEW222
Diamond Member
Diamond Member

Posts : 2197
Join date : 2011-08-13
Age : 40
Location : oakbank, mb

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty Re: Old Enya Show And Tell....

Post  GallopingGhostler on Sat Mar 16, 2019 1:43 pm

The stock thinner wire landing gear on my Ring Jr. is a bit weak, more often than not I have to straighten the gear back to its forward position after landing. I'd have to check, but think it is 5/64" dia. I don't know if there'd be any real advantage to a rubber shock mounted gear. Since yours will be lighter than mine, with the lighter engine upon landing, you'll be able to grease it in. Going to slightly larger diameter wheels will help it to roll better in grass.

The modern lightweight 5 spoke plastic with foam rubber wheels has a thin enough profile that it wouldn't be draggy in flight.

Your build looks really good, ought to be a decent performer.

I'm thinking a downsized S-1 to 36 - 38 inch wingspan would probably be the right ticket for the Enya .15-III TV. There's a lesser known Ringmaster discontinued by the 1980's, can't offhand remember the model name that had a 36 inch wingspan with a full body and trike gear that would be a shoe in for the Enya or its slightly larger brother the .19-V or .19-VI.
GallopingGhostler
GallopingGhostler
Diamond Member
Diamond Member

Posts : 2123
Join date : 2013-07-13
Age : 65
Location : Clovis, New Mexico

View user profile

Back to top Go down

Old Enya Show And Tell.... Empty Re: Old Enya Show And Tell....

Post  Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum