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Cox Engine of The Month
September-2021
crankbndr's

"Cherry Bomb" .051 engine

More info on this engine!




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Post  FlipStart Thu Sep 06, 2018 8:21 pm

Here is what I have in the 2 cheese boxes. It looks like parts for 6 complete engines with 1 still assembled.

Not sure of all the models designations but some.

Tee Dee .010, Pee Wee .020, Medallion .049, Tee Dee .049 (maybe .051), Baby Bee .049? and another Tee Dee .049 although I think maybe 1 of them is an .051. I haven't checked bore diameter yet. I don't know if that brass needle housing assembly or venturi by the right TD is for that engine or even a Cox item.

I didn't know Cox has so many different combustion chambers for their glow heads. Looks like a couple have a squish band around the circumference. The one on the left uses a standard short I assume glow plug. I'm thinking those heads were not made by Cox, but maybe.

That's my home made fuel tank on the edge of the boxes. I made that for a Quickie 200 (fun fly) I had one of the TD's in.
It even has a klunk that sounds like it's still attached to the internal fuel fuel line.

JeffMy Cox Engine Stash Dsc_0613My Cox Engine Stash Dsc_0614
My Cox Engine Stash Dsc_0616
My Cox Engine Stash Dsc_0617
My Cox Engine Stash Dsc_0615My Cox Engine Stash Dsc_0618


Last edited by Cribbs74 on Sun Aug 15, 2021 9:28 pm; edited 3 times in total (Reason for editing : Pictures didn't go, Oh, I forgot to hit Send I think.)
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Post  944_Jim Thu Sep 06, 2018 8:43 pm

Welcome aboard! The small stuff is getting pretty hard to get the big/hard parts for (cylinders/pistons).
All of them can be rebuilt with current vender parts (read that "not everything must come from eBay").
Small is fun...a little bigger is more fun!

PS, I like your hard "klunk" tank.
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Post  Admin Fri Sep 07, 2018 12:49 am

Nice collection of engines. Looks like you have most if not all the parts to to reassemble each one. Luckily your Pee Wee backplate still has all its mounting lugs. Be careful not the break them off, those backplates are getting rare and expensive. Tee Dee .010 parts, especially the piston and cylinder sets are also fetching crazy prices.

Some parts, like carb bodies and tanks are still being made and are available from Cox International and Ex Model Engines. These guys are currently the largest suppliers of these parts, they bought out most of the remaining stock when Estes (known for their rockets) shut down that part of their business (continuing to use the Cox name for a few electric models). Many will say the old Cox company that you all knew growing up died in 1996 when Estes bought them. Estes kept the core engine line available and a number of .049 models for several years into the 2000s, but as parts eventually ran out, specific engines were dropped. The Sure Start .049 was marked down to a ridiculous discount of $6.99 which lasted a few years before the big buyout by a group of buyers.

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Post  FlipStart Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:00 am

Thanks Jim, I had fun making the tank. I used the red back cover with the pressure tap for crankcase pressure to the tank in the Radio Controlled Quickie 200 and it usually ran great right-side-up or up-side-down. I don't remember the flight times I was getting but since "no carburetor" it was wide open for the whole flight and it was long enough that I was usually brain dead and ready for a rest by the end.

Jeff
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Post  FlipStart Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:23 am

Thanks for the information Jacob.

As I remember the the crank bushing is a little wobbly in the .020. The .010 I think may only have been bench run a couple of times. I would like to polish up some of the ugly aluminum parts for the TD.
I'll just half to clean them up and put back together. I need to find out which heads are considered stock for which engines.
Or maybe different heads for different nitro content in the fuel, prop size, altitude maybe.

It Looks like I'm in for some fun.

Jeff
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Post  Oldenginerod Fri Sep 07, 2018 2:21 am

Check out the links under the "INFO" heading on the left side of the page. Here's one for the Wikipedia Cox page.
https://www.coxengineforum.com/h31-cox-history
Go to the bottom page to get a good description on the different heads.

Rod.
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Post  FlipStart Fri Sep 07, 2018 11:56 pm

@Oldenginerod wrote:Check out the links under the "INFO" heading on the left side of the page. Here's one for the Wikipedia Cox page.
https://www.coxengineforum.com/h31-cox-history
Go to the bottom page to get a good description on the different heads.

Rod.

Thank you Rod!...  Hand Shake  What a great page! That's just what I needed.
Now I can figure out which one goes on which engine, stock anyway.
It looks like I have one of those special W element heads also.

Jeff I Love This Forum!
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Post  FlipStart Sun Sep 09, 2018 10:31 pm

I have been working on the TD .051 and got it pretty well cleaned up. The crank case, back cover & carburetor venture all had those gray parches/spots that these engines get when neglected. The manifold locking nut was pretty much all gray. I currently have a satin finish on that nut that I do with an old tooth brush, a little water & old school power Comet Cleanser. Depending on how much you scrub, how stiff the bristles & how wet the mixture you can get a nice satin finish on aluminum & some other metals.

I used one of those small brass or bronze wire brushes on most everything to remove the gray patches, on the aluminum parts
& surface rust on the outer cylinder & fins. There was some light surface rust on the cylinder walls with only 2 spots of any consequence (if even that) below one exhaust port. I used a .22 cal. barrel brush and just worked the surface rust off with that and it came out quite nice with no actual rust damage to the metal.
I just lightly put everything together for a photo shoot. The manifold isn't seated all the way and just have the prop driver barley on the splines. That spot on the piston which happened to show up in the photo isn't nearly as bad as it looks. I still gotta decide if to go satin or polish the nut and carb venture.

Jeff

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Post  getback Mon Sep 10, 2018 8:41 am

Good job on the clean up , she looks Nice This address has some good info while your reading > go to BACK TO HOME PAGE at the mid point of page > http://www.mh-aerotools.de/airfoils/index_centerframe.htm This Site Rocks!
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Post  FlipStart Sat Aug 14, 2021 11:42 am

@getback wrote:Good job on the clean up , she looks Nice This address has some good info while your reading > go to BACK TO HOME PAGE at the mid point of page > http://www.mh-aerotools.de/airfoils/index_centerframe.htm This Site Rocks!

Thanks for the great link. I love aerodynamics in general, really festinating the way air behaves.

I was really lucky to have joined the right sailplane club in my earliest R/C modeling days. Lots of super knowledgeable guys with an emphasis in teaching newbies like me in not just how to fly sailplanes but how they fly at all and what affects their flying behavior.
This was in the early 80's when most R/C sailplanes were still built from boxes of wood, or wood and foam cores. Fiberglass fuselages were getting fairly common though. Aquila Grande, Pantera etc.

Those were the best times I had in my modeling days, so far. The planes now are all hollow molded and you really can't change anything, except CG and maybe a few little things. But if it has to much tail moment, to bad, your stuck with it unless you wack some off and stick it back together, which would be ugly.
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Post  944_Jim Sat Aug 14, 2021 12:13 pm

FP,
Wachabendoin for the last few years?
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Post  FlipStart Sat Aug 14, 2021 4:03 pm

@944_Jim wrote:FP,
Wachabendoin for the last few years?

Not very much actually. I retired from my money making job of 15 years in early 2019. I have just been trying to figure out what to do in retirement. It still feels kind of weird not having to go back to work. I do keep in contact with my ex supervisor and we get together for lunch now and again. She keeps me informed on how things are going with the crew. The virus situation has been tough as we took care of an art center that I still shut down completely I'm thinking. It is all about people in close contact.

I been playing with my vintage audio gear a little, but not that much. I'm actually downsizing my complement of audio stuff. I was a big Goodwill hunter and ended up with a lot of tape decks and other audio junk, so I'm 'paying it forward' I got the stuff cheep, fixed it if needed and now giving it back again. This way someone else gets a working deck and might follow in my footsteps in the vintage audio world.

I been playing R/C cars a little but my main interest is still flying. I take my park flyer Extra 300 out when weather permits. It's a fun plane.

I found out about this forum when I met the administrator of this site on tapeheads.net which is a vintage audio forum that is mostly tape related.
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Post  Yabby Sat Aug 14, 2021 6:54 pm

Goodaye Flipstart,

Some aerospace stuff you might be interested in. Some consider this to be controversial but I prefer it to the idea that a Vacuum created by the wings shape lifts it into the air! https://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/Summer_Training/Elementary97/planearticle.html Lots of people dont like this theory, but I reckon you will find on the "inside" of design shops for extreme on the edge aircraft design, this is the basis of design theory, modelling etc. Many universities still teach that aircraft get sucked into the air because thats been the basis since, forever! :-) and here is the NASA Aerodynamics index https://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/airplane/short.html Lots of good reading in there for those interested in this sort of stuff.

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Post  FlipStart Sat Aug 14, 2021 8:26 pm

Thanks for the link to the NASA aerodynamic information. I totally agree with their description of how an airfoil works in that first page. All airfoils have to fly at a positive angle of attack to generate lift. Sailplanes are interesting in that their only means of propulsion is gravity; they half to fly downward and have the lowest possible drag for good efficiency. Speed can of course be converted to altitude. A sailplane is largely flying down in the air it's in. It only goes up relative to the ground if the air the plane is in is rising in relation to the ground faster than the plane is descending through that air.
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Post  Oldenginerod Sun Aug 15, 2021 6:52 am

@FlipStart wrote: A sailplane is largely flying down in the air it's in. It only goes up relative to the ground if the air the plane is in is rising in relation to the ground faster than the plane is descending through that air.

Gliding is just fantastic.  First attempt (at full size) just blew my mind.  Unhitched from the winch at 1,000 feet, pilot handed control over to me, got me into a slow left bank and we chatted for about 2-3 minutes when he said "level out, we've just put on another 1,000 feet."  I wasn't aware that we managed to land in a thermal from the get-go, and with no input of energy from our side of things, nature just made us keep flying!!
Pretty much dead quiet.  Pilot told me if I can hear the wind, pull up a little, if it gets bumpy, nose down a little.  Simple.   lol!

I'd never been up prior to my brother being killed in a gliding accident, but after that happened I was determined to go up to get an idea of what Pete loved so much about it.  I can really see the attraction and would have probably kept up with it if I was a little closer to my brother's gliding club, which was about four hours drive. Sadly, after they lost Pete and soon after another member, interest in the club died off quickly and it pretty much folded.

Got a couple of large sailplanes (gliders) in my stash, along with a pod mounted Texico I was given, which I really ought to get in the air, if I can only find somewhere to fly.
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Post  rsv1cox Sun Aug 15, 2021 7:14 am

Hi Jeff,

I enjoyed looking at your cheesebox pictures, nice clean stuff. Your parts saved over the years or a recent purchase? I looked for the rather rare "W" element in the Cox heads but did not see one. Nice restoration of the TD .051 too.

Bob
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Post  FlipStart Sun Aug 15, 2021 1:48 pm

@Oldenginerod: I'm so sorry to here about your brothers death in a sailplane accident.

I was up one time many years ago but the piolet was working in tight turns to hook a thermal and I didn't get a chance at the controls. At times we were banked over hard enough that when I looked out the side I was looking at the ground below. It was strange as I had no sensation of forward movement, just seems like we were rotating still in space. It was nice and quiet except for wind whistling at the canopy hatches but when the wheel hit the runway on landing it started vibrating and shaking as the runway wasn't all that nice. The plane was a blue Schweizer.
Do you know the names of your large sailplanes?


Thanks Bob!... No recent buys on the engine parts, I think I bought all the Cox stuff new back in the day. Oh wait, I think I did get those heads possibly from Kraft.

Thanks, I'll probably put the TD .051 in that Lil Snip I have some day.
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